I come across vacant churches all the time in my daily property search. Obviously they are vacant because a church didn’t work at that location so buying them to renovate into a better church is out of the question. If you own a church that your renting out, how stable are the tenants and what kind of turnover can be expected?
I need some thoughts on what I can change a church into without rebuilding the entire thing. What can the rooms be converted to, accounting for the strange layout, cost effectively?
P.S.- I’m not the religious type so don’t use church jargon. AKA: I understand there is a big room with benches in it, I wouldn’t know what your talking about if you called anything by it’s proper name.
I have seen larger ones that had a lot of rooms converted into apartments. Looked kind of like a regular apt building with more ornate windows. Obvoiusly only certain designs would work without massive rennovation.
Thanks Rich and Sean. Converting a church into apartments would be very difficult without ripping open walls and floors to run all the extra plumbing and electrical. I’m loving the night club idea. I can’t think of any better place for a night club or strip club than a former church :o . Most churches have the perfect layout to; one big main room, a commercial kitchen, several small V.I.P. lounges, minimal number of bathrooms. This was just the thing I was looking for. All it would need is some cosmetic adjustments so the patrons don’t feel guilty about what their doing…
Those names are perfect. Husbands would be telling their wives they were at church all night. Clubs might be a very viable option for church conversions.
i have looked at churches on the market, generally for residential conversions, and after looking at nearly 10 deals, ive never seemed to make the numbers work
although this may be limited to deal i have looked at, i usually find that the churches have very little parking, which may be a reason the church group is selling it, to find betting parking arrangements.
I’ve also noticed a parking problem with churches in small towns. Usually they are built on or near a main road and the rest of the town now suffocates the church. In major cities this is less of a problem because everyone walks, takes a cab or bus everywhere anyway.
I was also thinking that a restaurant would fit in a former church pretty well. Most churches have the right layout for restaurants and wouldn’t need anything more than a few basic upgrades and adjustments. These vacant churches I keep finding do have some potential. If anyone owns a building with a restaurant as a tenant… What can be expected?
In properties that I own that I rent to restaurants (note that many of my properties like this are in smaller towns), I structure the lease so that I can make turnover, which seems to me to be inevitable, to run rather smoothly.
Another way of looking at it, is that I own the “restaurant franshise” in town. Not literally, however I have made some significant infrastructure upgrades and capital investments into the establishments’ that I own and it would be hard for a newcommer to spend or borrow the capital necessary to be able to compete with me.
By design, because I am in smaller markets, it is not impossilbe, but unusual at least that someone would open a pub, or dining establishment accross the street from me.
So, I own “the” restaurant properties. Every couple of years a “biz-oper” (entrepreur) has a great idea to start “thier own little place” and I rent it to them. If they fail, I rent it to the next guy.
Even with improvements, as I strive to have the best quality properties in my markets, after owning a few of the sites for 10 years, I have them largely paid down.
Get the sweet lighting system set up. Best sound system with an oval bar in the middle, and a few over flow bars and your making a killing. If you are in say a downtown type setting in a half way decent demographic. Vip is in the alter boy and priests quarters…etc
If I understand correctly, the tenants are in something other than a triple net lease. Also you have a clause that says something along the lines of “If you fail, your out” so the tenants aren’t locked into the lease when they obviously can’t afford to stay thus limiting evictions. Essentially you have a monopoly on the restaurant properties in your area so any up and coming restauranter on a small budget will be going to you which gives you a waiting list of tenants. Does changing the interior of the restaurant come out of your pocket with every turnover since most small start ups can’t afford it? If so, are you then compensated by the rent or by partnering up with the tenant in the restaurant?
Sean,
Sounds like you’ve been to a few bars… and churches?
Big,
A movie theater and comedy club are 2 more good ideas. Any experiences/ recommendations to share on either?
I work in a small town and up here the nearest movie theater is 30 minutes plus away. Some smart guy took an small old theater that’s been closed for years and opened it up again with dinner served during the movie so its dinner and a movie under one roof…the place is packed on the weekends I’ve been told. If its one big room you can show the biggest feature of the week on it and serve dinner. I think to make it work they take your order before the movie starts and bring out food during an intermission. You’d have to setup the seats a little different and have some sort of drop down tray table in front of the seats or something like that. I don’t know about the one here but ones in other towns that I’ve seen on TV also served drinks, as you know alcohol has a huge profit margin and ups tips considerably.
Sounds like an interesting business model. I guess everyone would have assigned and numbered seats like a sporting event. I suppose airport seats would be required as well. Either that or individual circular tables that seat 3 or 4 in rows on different levels. In the latter food and drinks could be brought out during the movie with minimal interuption. Waiters also woudn’t have to climb through rows of seats to get to the middle. I’m surprised that your girlfriend hasn’t made you take her to this theater yet. If/ When she does, take some mental notes on the operation of the place.
There was one of these places in Bethesda, MD about 15 yrs ago…not sure if it is still there. They took out the traditional seating and redid the floor in like 8 ft deep tiers up from the screen and set 2-4-6-top round tables on the tiers.
You ordered drinks (incl. cocktails) and your meal before the movie started and the servers brought stuff all through the show with very little disruption.
I think one had pushbutton reordering for drink refills. Like when your beer gets empty you can hit a button on a remote thing and someone will bring one out.
Whenever I think I have an original idea, I always find out it’s been done before. I’m in MD so I am going to have to check out the place in Bethesda if it’s still around. It sounds similar to the vision I had.
Rich,
A remote ordering system is a great idea. If the room had individual tables instead of rows of seats, I could extend the ordering system to emcompass everything on the menu from a touchscreen computer or something. That would limit disruptions even more and would encourage patrons to order more food and drinks throughout the movie.
Thanks for everyones relies. I really should pay you all some money but for all I know your members of Jihad and I would be further contributing to your cause, so too bad.