I just read The Section 8 Bible. The authors recommend removing the garbage disposal (because the tenants will jam it with utensils), the washer/dryer hookups, screen doors and even some windows from a potential Section 8 properties to help pass inspection and avoid having to do repairs.
I’m wondering if the Section 8 landlords here do this type of thing? One problem I can see is if you modify the unit in this way you limit your ability to market it to regular tenants as well as Section 8.
Our two houses with Section 8 tenants are equipped the same as our others. Not all Section 8 tenants are horrible. One lady’s house is extremely clean and well organized. She is on the program because of an injury. She’s recently divorced and receiving disability. The other lady’s house has bugs in it and she doesn’t seem to care. It was that way when we took over and I have no reason to believe we’d be successful in keeping the critters gone if we treated it. You can’t force someone to be a good housekeeper.
Thanks–the garbage disposal idea made sense to me but the other things seemed extreme.
This is NOT a Section 8 issue. This IS a low income issue. The sorry fact is that the socialists of our country have enslaved the lower class with handouts. Providing handouts encourages laziness and destroys pride and honor. That causes most low income people to live like what they are - deadbeats. They aren’t going to take care of anything they own or rent BECAUSE THEY DIDN’T EARN THOSE THINGS!
Removing non-essential frills is absolutely ESSENTIAL if you are going to survive in the low-income rental business. I not only remove garbage disposals, but all of the following other stuff: dishwashers; screen doors; storm windows; ceiling fans; sink sprayers; and carpet, vinyl, laminate, and tile floors when possible (in favor of painting wood floors). Low income tenants simply aren’t smart enough to have these things and WILL destroy them in short order. This is a BUSINESS and we’re in business to make money, not to provide frills to low income tenants who will destroy them in short order.
Mike
HoldandBuy,
I just can’t believe that tenants wouldn’t be happier and would stay longer if they HAD washer/dryer hookups, dishwashers, screen doors and everything worked.
It seems to me that perhaps you might continually upgrade your tenant pool instead of always renting to the lowest common denominator.
I have rented to Section 8 before and I liked it. I liked inspecting the house once a year and fixing the cracked switch plate covers, the torn screens and the off-track closet doors. It kept my house in good repair, the tenant happy, and the section 8 rent checks coming in.
People like being proud of where they live. There is something wrong with the idea of removing amenities because tenants are low-life. I would rather be striving to get more middle-working class tenants by offering the things those tenants expect–like washer/dryer hookups.
Furnishedowner
The authors of Section 8 Bible were renting to people in the worst neighborhoods in Philadelphia, so I don’t know how typical their experience is. I don’t know how bad the area of Ohio where Mike landlords is…
To me it makes sense to leave the existing appliances in at first for a trial run, and if it turns out to be a total disaster remove them in the future on a case by case basis (that’s what they recommend with the screen doors in the book).
People like being proud of where they live. There is something wrong with the idea of removing amenities because tenants are low-life. I would rather be striving to get more middle-working class tenants by offering the things those tenants expect--like washer/dryer hookups.
Most low income tenants ARE low income tenants precisely because they don’t have any pride. They are lazy. They make poor choices. The taxpayer pays a lot of their bills. When you EARN something, you have pride in it. When everything is given to you, you have no pride (or a reason to be proud) and you treat things accordingly.
You’re talking about apples and oranges. Low income tenants are not middle-working class tenants. Low income rentals are not middle-working class rentals. They’re two entirely different things. Putting amenities in a low income rental that are appropriate to a middle income rental is foolish and unprofitable. This business is about making money, not running a charity.
To me it makes sense to leave the existing appliances in at first for a trial run, and if it turns out to be a total disaster remove them in the future on a case by case basis (that's what they recommend with the screen doors in the book).
The problem is that if the appliances are in there when you rent the unit, you’re responsible for their maintenance. It’s ridiculous to put the time and money into maintaining this equipment in a low income rental. The rents simply are not high enough to justify it. Furthermore, low income rentals normally can’t become middle income rentals. Everyone, including the tenants, know which areas of town are low income and which are working class. No decent working class person is going to live in a low income neighborhood because the rental has a dishwasher.
Mike
I see what you’re saying. I guess everyone has to find what works for them in a given situation.
[quote author=propertymanager
The problem is that if the appliances are in there when you rent the unit, you’re responsible for their maintenance. It’s ridiculous to put the time and money into maintaining this equipment in a low income rental. The rents simply are not high enough to justify it. Furthermore, low income rentals normally can’t become middle income rentals. Everyone, including the tenants, know which areas of town are low income and which are working class. No decent working class person is going to live in a low income neighborhood because the rental has a dishwasher.
Mike
[/quote]
I agree, I woudn’t board over windows! That’s going pretty far for most areas of the country. Having said that, boarding over windows might be right in the slums of Philadelphia. If the morons frequently break them out, you don’t want one window more than necessary!
My point really is that you need to equip the rental for the tenants you will have. If you rent multi-million dollar apartments in NYC, then installing the finest amenities would be appropriate. If you’re renting to the lowest income tenants, then minimal amenities are appropriate.
Mike
Yes, that was their rationale–that you only need one window in the front to pass inspection so by eliminating the other two windows you eliminate the chance of having them broken by street punks.
I have some properties across the bridge from Philly in Camden, NJ and I regret not heeding the words in the Sct8 bible. :banghead…I’ve been bitten by leaving in washer and dryer hook ups and damn near every year i fail inspection because of a screen door or electric door bell…what i’ve been doing is eliminating these thing when they fail right in front of the tenant so they know why they lost the amenity…i havent had the heart to paint a floor yet…but with the way this last tenant left the carpets…i am getting there.
And don’t forget — SEAL OFF ALL FIRE PLACES IN LOW INCOME RENTALS! HAHA!
And don't forget --- SEAL OFF ALL FIRE PLACES IN LOW INCOME RENTALS! HAHA!
ABSOLUTELY! If the idiots aren’t smart enough for a ceiling fan or door bell, you certainly don’t want them playing with fire!
Mike
#$@$ you mean no Santa?!?!
Screen your tenants properly so you don’t get the dirty lazy tenants. Some of Sec. 8 tenants are clean freaks and want everything perfect. Ask the tenant why they are moving from their last place. If they say because its dirty and has bugs is the answer than ask how long its been that way. If they have lived like this for months ,they are part of the problem. Drive by the last place and see what condition it is in. If you offer little you get less quality. Sceening the tenant is huge in section 8. If the sec. 8 tenant does not pay at least half the rent themselves, I won’t touch them. You take care of what you pay for…
I always tell prospective tenants that I like Sec. 8 tenants becasue of the rules. The rules are no traffic on the property(extra income earning :rolleyes), no bugs in the unit ever and if it leaks call and tell us so we can fix it. If they can’t live with that than we shouldn’t work together. These are my rules as a property owner.
I have in the past had to put into the lease that if the sink backs up more than 3 times and is tenant inflected than they pay. For that matter anything that is tenant inflected that repeadly happens iIcharge them for. They have to understand the rules to take pride in where they live.