A for sale sign with your phone number on it, (but not your house) a random vacant foreclosed house, this is what a guru is telling people to do to generate a buyers list for yourself, is this legal??
OK. I looked up a definition on dictionary.com for you. I think “b” applies to this scenario.
tres·pass/ˈtrɛspəs, -pæs/ Show Spelled [tres-puhs, -pas] Show IPA
noun
- Law.
a. an unlawful act causing injury to the person, property, or rights of another, committed with force or violence, actual or implied.
b. a wrongful entry upon the lands of another.
c. the action to recover damages for such an injury. - an encroachment or intrusion.
- an offense, sin, or wrong.
verb (used without object) - Law. to commit a trespass.
- to encroach on a person’s privacy, time, etc.; infringe (usually followed by on or upon ).
- to commit a transgression or offense; transgress; offend; sin.
I would not placet the sign in the yard as typically seen, but on the telephone pole out front might work.
Whether it’s legal or not – or whether you post your sign on a telephone pole instead of on the property itself – isn’t it dishonest? Is this how you want to run your business? Won’t this mean you will begin your relationships with potential new buyers by lying to them? What would you say to someone who calls? “Oh, that property is no longer available, but if you give me your name and number, I’ll blah, blah, blah…” Suppose some of the smarter/more skeptical buyers realize what you’re doing and start blasting you in online forums like this one?
Sorry, I tend to look at “What’s the worst that could happen?” more closely than “What could I gain?” when considering biz activities. This just seems too shady to me.
If you want to place a sign up then they work best in high exposure/traffic areas. Think major intersections or heavily travel roads. So if this house is in the middle of the neighborhood that does not give you a lot of exposure.
Also, just because a “guru” is telling you to do it does not mean it is legal in that township. Hanging Bandit signs on poles in my area is illegal. I know people that have been doing hanging bandit signs for years and never been fined. I know others that have been fined several thousands of dollars. Bandit signs do work so you need to factor that into your risk tolerance and budget.
This is a more guerrilla-type marketing approach I suppose, but nobody will give a rip that you do this.
As far as ‘telling people the house is no longer available’; why would we say ‘that?’
Instead we simply explain that we’re looking for buyers for houses like the one they called on. Period. Anyone would understand what we’re trying to accomplish.
If not, we don’t want to deal with them anyway. Life’s too short.
They’re probably nuisance, bargain hunters.
Meantime, whomever is leaving the house vacant and not attempting to market it, won’t care either, if they ever know.
As well, we’re collecting names, not trying to sell the house. Of course we don’t take calls personally from these types of signs. We direct calls to a voice mail, or a website, where we capture names, phone numbers, and emails.
We never answer the ‘buyer line’ because we’ll be on the phone all day, clogging up our schedule, if not dealing with angry owners that we stuck a for sale sign in their yard. j/k !
Meanwhile, we call prospects back and pick their brains about their financing capability; or how much cash they’ve got; or where their money’s coming from; and how long they need to close, etc. etc. We already know what kind of house they’re looking for, don’t we?
Getting all cramped up over putting a sign on the lawn of a vacant house, that we presume is not being marketed otherwise, is not illegal, unethical, or in any way damaging to anyone, but it is a great way to find sellers for a particular type/condition of house.
Again, the house with which we’re baiting buyers, will attract a niche of buyers only. So, whatever condition/location/type of house we’re advertising, will fairly dictate the buyer profile.
Now, don’t tell anyone else about this strategy, or everyone and their dog is gonna be posting “for sale” signs on the weed-eaten front yards of vacant houses.
Meantime, go for it. It’s always easier to ask forgiveness than it is for permission.
A while ago, I was marketing a huge house for sale, and I wanted to put a 4x6 banner sign in the empty, corporately-owned, lot right off the freeway near the house to see what kind of response I would get (It was a $150 experiment).
I called the corporate lot owners and asked permission to put my sign up. They said “no.”
So instead, I put my banner sign ‘next’ to the corporate lot, on the public easement. (insert evil laugh).
After all that, my response rate sucked drain water, except that I was getting calls from investors, not homeowners. Imagine.
Now, if I had just put my banner sign on the corporate owned lot without asking permission, nobody would have been the wiser, or cared. But after alerting all the minnows in the corporate pond of lot ownership, they cya’d themelves six ways from Sunday by disallowing my sign placement.
I’ve learned since then (actually several times over, because I’m a slow learner), to just do what I want, and then remain nimble enough to cross any bridges later. Frankly, that’s just the better approach to anything short of dating.
I’ve always believed that for the most part, its easier to ask forgiveness is better than asking permission, because people are trained to say no to anything outside of their box! But when it comes to legalities, and fines, I like to play it safe because I am a horrible poker player.
The guru is an idiot and definitely now a law student. Besides other consequences in my state that I usually do business in it is state law that posting a sign without the written permission of the owner is a $300 fine. Not counting the other items that can enter the picture such as fraud, trespass, damages ( one idiot put the stake through the sprinkler system).
Why does the guru suggest it, because it can and does work but when a prospect finds out you are a con man and has a mind you didn’t expect or predict your life can become a target for revenge. I know of one case where a new investor wished he had never done it.
One of the most important aspects of sales is the relationship between seller and buyer… If you are trying to build a list by lying to people you are attempting to start that relationship on the wrong foot.
Javipa, for all the reason you posted, I just went through the exercise of tracking someone down who did what you propose.
NEEDLESS to say THEY will not post on my property again!
I’m sure there’ll always be anecdotal evidence of this not working as expected, but as a practical matter, it’s more effective than the risk would present.
Just for giggles, let’s say the “poster” was fined hundreds, if not thousands of dollars. So, what?
The upside is worth many thousands of dollars, over and over. After making the first $20,000 he can afford to pay several $300 fines. Whoopsie doodle. It’s the cost of doing business profitably.
Meanwhile, we’re talking about posting bandit signs on vacant, un-marketed properties. Not on the houses with a Keller Williams signs in the yard, or something being rented, or rehabbed.
I mean don’t we use our heads here?
And frankly, the classic C- areas always have dilapidated properties sitting vacant, where a marketing sign could be placed with zero downside, to attract business.
As an aside, the very houses we target for this, should be on our list of prospects in the first place.
Notwithstanding, as far as the ‘mis-framing’ of our offers with something illegal, or unethical, I would ask, “When was the last time any professional (or amateur) bargain hunters cared less how they found a deal?” They don’t. They just care about finding the deal.
Again, we’re not attempting to sell the property the bandit signs are posted on. We’re just generating leads.
Finally, we can choose to be liked, or we can choose to make money. These two things don’t necessarily go together.
I’m just happy to make money now. I can always buy some friends later.
They’re right posting a “For Sale” sign is illegal and dishonest BUT. . . placing a “For Info” sign with a google or other voicemail-only or forwarding phone number will get your phone ringing. I’ve used a “For Info” sign on properties I was wholesaling to gauge interest in the property and start building a buyer’s list. Also, if you place it on a vacant/abandoned property, there’s a chance you might get a call from the owner either cussing you out or interested in selling. :cool
Good luck!