In fact, if a book has a point, multiple readers ought to come up with the same answer when asked what that point is. If they come up with different answers, it is either because the author was incompetent at communicating his point, or because the book has no point, or because the author deliberately obfuscated the point.
OR
everyone is different, and those readers are all at different places in their lives financially at the time they read the book, some read with their hearts, some with their minds - ask people what 9/11 meant to them and you’ll get a million different answers.
I’m not hell bent on defending RDPD - I know what it meant to me, and that can’t be taken away - but Reed just seems like a pissed off loser with nothing else to do but write page after page of negative comments about his competition.
Perhaps not all of the facts line up with his level of research, and I do agree if you are going for artistic difference in the production of a fiction your book should have a definite theme laid out and supported in each subsuquent chapter that someone can follow. To quote one of the wisest men on this earth. "Cynics do not contribute, skeptics do not create, doubters do not achieve." -Gordon B. Hinkley, President LDS church.
The Problem with his argument are the thousands of stories like mine. Dead last of 10 kids here, from a working family. NO CLUE ABOUT financial literacy until one day I picked up RDPD and came to an understanding that there is more to finance than working and paying your bills, until the day you die. RDPD is like the Bible of my financial frame. And although as with EVERY financial book and I have read dozens now you must discard the ocassional over the top, "YOUR GONNA BE RICH AS MIDAS EASY" statement, it is a phenominally well written book, easy to read and phenominally popular. I believe Robert K has done America a service by helping to shake many millionaires out of poor situations where there seemed to be no option.
And for Reed, If the only way he can keep his name in front of people is to attack others then his personal buisness model will become ineffective when the general investor base become saturated and agitated with his tyraids, and then if he does not simply bring his game to a level where it speaks for him, we can say goodbye to Reed.
Well, thanks for the idea, but I already tend to steer clear of buying products I clearly do not endorse. I’m not sure if you didn’t catch that already from my posts, but I’m not buying his stuff. I’m clearly on one side of this discussion “John T. Reed’s analysis of Robert T. Kiyosaki’s book Rich Dad, Poor Dad”. If you don’t like that there are two sides to the discussion then you should leave it or come to the table with a real argument. This is an important topic to me and I’d imagine most around boards like these, if it turns into a pissing war between Kiyosaki supporters and opposers then nothing gets accomplished.
His point here is that the book is a motivational story book with no real financial knowledge to impart. He asks ‘why doesn’t everyone get the same point?’ in an attempt to try to get people, who give this book so much faith, to explain just what they took away from it. If the book is so vague that people are getting very different ideas from each other, then all we can really say is ‘this book made me think about money’, or ‘this book opened my eyes to finance’. Fine, if it did that for you, kind of like it did for me, great. But the problem isn’t that he writes a motivational story book, it’s that he tries to make it seem like a fact-based book, when it appears largely probable that it is anything but that (and, in fact, may just be a story about money by a guy who never had much, written in a way to make him, and therefore his advice/story, ring true).
Yes, but if he did make millionaires, it was because he motivated them, not because he provided any tangible financial advice. And if it is purely motivational, get it out of the non-fiction section and don’t include things that implicitly portray fact (buying a porsche through your corporation) when they are just meant to be a story.
Yes, Reed has appointed himself the policeman of gurus. That is a way he pushes his name in front of people; However, and please correct me if I’m wrong, but didn’t Kiyosaki’s works first become popular through Oprah (or was it multilevel marketing / MLM that launched him?)? Either way, I don’t think Reed’s (unique) approach is much more tasteless than either of the aforementioned routes taken by Kiyosaki. In fact, in a forum dedicated to creative real estate and fresh financial ideas (or so we hope lol), it seems weird that people don’t respect Reed’s unique approach to marketing his books. I do. I suspect the reason most don’t is because either Reed disapproves of their favorite guru (which is a 99.9% possibility), or because they have seen Reed make a disparaging comment about a guru that proved to be inaccurate. If the reason is the later, then I’ll be the first to say that it bothers me too. However, if his information is largely accurate, that is about as much as you can say for the vast majority of gurus anyways, so it’s not fair to hate Reed because he unfairly came down on the pactrust or messed up on this regard, without also disowning Sheets for some of the errors in his materials.
For everyone hopping in mid-thread here is the link to John Reed’s review of rich dad poor dad. I sincerely hope that everyone participating in this thread thus far has read the entire page. I read parts of the page a long time ago and thought this was just some guy with a bone to pick. Then, after a while, I re-read it (after reading something of John Reed’s, completely unrelated to any gurus, that was some amazing material). After reading the entire page, in a 20 minute period, I went from supporting Kiyosaki to wishing that I hadn’t been recommending his book. I truly hope, that for fairness’ sake, that everyone here in this thread has read the entire review. If not then there’s no way you will stop supporting Kiyosaki and, more importantly, you won’t be able to properly contribute to this thread. Here’s the link again: http://www.johntreed.com/Kiyosaki.html
Hopefully we can keep this tasteful because this is important to a majority of us I’d imagine, and due to the feelings in this thread I’m hoping it won’t degrade into a flame war.
I don’t think anyone HATES Reed. It is his approach to evaluating Guru’s. His lenghty dessertation regarding who RK’s rich father may or may not be did not lend itself to an open evaluation of the material that Rk teaches. Marketing is a game Truth and honesty don’t always prevail in the profiles of our heros. Some of our presidents can not stand indepth scrutiny of their lives of their public personna.
But, if they do some good in the world, if they make a difference in people’s lives for the better we tend to forgive their indiscretions. We don’t forget but we can live with their contributions to a better life for people who choose to use the strategies that are set forth.
I don’t think he actually teaches any specific strategy, per se. Instead, he teaches you how to think in a different mindset. I have only read Retire Young, Retire Rich, so I’m only basing my assumptions on that one book. In it, he tries wo make you envision finances from a different angle. For example, many people harp about debt and all its evils, yet he explains that you can harness the power of debt to get rich. He also focuses almost the entire book on leverage. Not only using OPM as leverage or some other financial leverage, but also leveraging other facets of your life. He also spends only one chapter talking about real estate, and enforces that the books isn’t there to teach you how, but why.
Now, people can blast away at Kiyosaki about specifics, but I know firsthand that his book was the proverbial light bulb for me and others that got us started down the path of financial independence. Is his book the only one that has that power? Certainly not - and probably not even the best. But his approach works (at least for me and some others I know), and that’s what matters at the end of the day.
John Reed has a problem for ethics, I promise you will never find him posting anonymously about himself.
If you mean it’s because I disapprove of Kiyosaki, then it’s just because of what he’s written. If it’s because I endorse Reed, that also is because his writing is among the best I’ve read. Others in these forums will attest to the quality of his readings. He’s not a typical ‘guru’, he doesn’t make the stuff easy, he doesn’t have a million tricks to help you get into a property despite the fact that you’re worth very little dollars and have a poor credit standing. In that way, he is actually quite refreshing to read.
I’m sure that was just a joke (although I believe that the last 2 comments you posted were of zero relevance to the thread), but I hope you don’t honestly think that people who disapprove of Kiyosaki must be Reed supporters (or John Reed). I’m in college, and I can tell you that I know of finance people at the university level who laugh about this book. In fact, I’m wondering if many finance professionals at all support this book. That would be quite revealing I bet. Any finance majors or teachers in the house?
Good summation, if it works it works, at the end of the day that is what matters.
I fully agree with you on that, but if we are only getting motivation from Kiyosaki in particular, and other authors would provide both motivation AND something practical, then we need to support other authors.
The reason I inquired about what specific thing Kiyosaki taught some poster was because the answers, aside from typically being different depending on who is telling, are almost always things that everyone always knows. It isn’t fair to say that he ‘teaches a new light’ or viewpoint if he really doesn’t. His viewpoint is that, to make money, you’d be better off buying a business than a car? Did anyone really learn something from that? Or that you get rich by “making your money work for you”, implying that if you put your money in an investment you’ll get richer than if you spent it on something consumable? Didn’t we already know that?
As I’ve said (and continue to), I read his book, loved it, and credit it for me being here in the first place (his book combined with Napoleon Hill’s). However, in retrospect, I see his book as extremely motivating in tone, but little more than a financial-fantasy comic book on any plans, details, strategies, etc.
If this book is only a motivator, and is a fiction-based motivator with glaring technical errors revolving around business that could actually set back a newbie, then maybe it is time that this book stops getting recommendations, and instead a more valid choice is picked.
Are we all in agreement that his book is only for motivation, and not to be taken as a ‘how-to’, or strategy book of any sort? If in disagreement, please explain what ideas he gave you that the general public was not already knowledgable about.
Keith, in reviewing my posts I cannot find what the problem was, and I don’t see any indication that it was already corrected or edited by a mod, so I’m stuck. Just pm me or post what is offensive and I’ll remove it; if a preemptive warning, I will absolutely keep it civil.
And one last thing - I feel that people don’t know much about Reed, and therefore may devalue his opinion since he does, truly, come off a little (or medium) crazy. John Reed is old I believe, and doens’t invest anymore. He’s an investment (and other topics, he self publishes) writer, a previous investor, a west point grad/ united states military academy (very respected military school), and also holds an MBA from Harvard. I figured his background is useful because it would have changed my perception of him the first time I had encountered his writings, and I don’t want people who glance at the page this topic is about to form a quick-glance opinion of him, which is easy to do. I also am repeatedly inquiring about how many of you truly read John Reed’s entire rebuttal. This is important, as glancing at it isn’t the same thing, nor is skimming through it. I have a buddy who still supported Kiyosaki after I read this article and tried explaining all of it to him. He continued to support Kiyosaki and told me Reed was (well, I promised Keith I’d keep it polite.). He’s a very good friend of mine, so I asked him to please read the article. He withdrew support.
I’d like to think that everyone commenting in this thread has read the entire Reed article, and if you haven’t read it in its entirety, please do yourself a favor and read it so you either change your mind, or have more material to disagree with here in the thread.
Nouveau Riche(Phoenix, AZ)—I do not recommend
James Phillip Piccolo filed Chapter 7 bankruptcy in Phoenix on 8/27/90 (petition #2:90-bk-09050-RGM). On 6/16/92, a Phoenix grand jury indicted James Phillip Piccolo for “Theft, a class 3 felony and Trafficking in stolen property, first degree, a Class 2 felony,” namely, the theft of a 1981 Mercedes Benz and the sale of its parts (No. CR92-91584). Piccolo pled guilty on 12/7/92 and was found guilty by Judge David L. Grounds of the Superior Court of Arizona, Maricopa County.
Now its give me 17k and we might be able to do something in 100 years!!!
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I know of him but am not a student of his…I have one of his boks around here somewhere, so I guess that sorta makes me a "supporter of Kiyosaki’s product line’…