Is my math right ?

I am as green as a gourd when it comes to the concept of flipping houses and buying subject to and exiting loan. I have read a few thousand pages on these subjects including these forums. I am about to go all out, full blown with advertising next week…Spending a lot of money on ads. The following is a hypothetical or simulation deal. I am mostly interested in streaming income. I would like to rent these properties / sell on Land contract.

Seller has 30 year mortgage with a balance of 104,705.
110,000 is the original amount of the loan in 2001 at 8.25% with a monthly payment of 826.39 PI and 145.00 TI. Seller has total payment of $971.39. Seller is 5 payments ($4,856.95) behind and in foreclosure. To bring Mortgage current:

PITI $4,856.95
Late fees 325.00
Attorney Fees 675.00

Total is $5,856.95

The house is in good shape, other then needing Paint, carpet, cabinet facings and tile in the bathroom for the total repair:
Paint $1000
Tile $1000
Carpet $2000
Misc $ 500

Total $4,500.00 plus or minus 2-3%

The house appraises at 129,000 Low and 145,000 high in its after repair value. I offer the seller $4000 walking expenses with a 3 year subject to with land trust with trustee as third party LLC non-profit. So thus far I have:
To Sellers Bank $ 5856.95
To Seller $ 4000.00
Repair cost $ 4500.00
Carry cost $ 971.39
Misc $ 500.00

Total $15,828.00 Plus or minus 4-6%

Total expenses for taking this property are $15,828.00…this is the total cost. I pay the mortgage down to bring it out of foreclosure.

Seller Loan balance (current) $ 104,705.56
All repairs and holding costs $ 15,828.
Agents commissions (6%) $ 8,160
Capital gains tax of $10,300.00

Total net expenses $ 138,993.56

Sell amount with broke/real-estate agent $136.000

Total profit of ( $ - 3000 NEGITIVE )

Capital gains and agents commissions kill me.

Now of course this looks much easier on paper then in a real world scenario I know. As I said in the beginning of this pipe dream was that I am mostly interested in streaming income.

So here is the rent land contract scenario :

I advertise and do the selling myself …I advertise as a no qualifying, bad credit ok, home with $6,000 Down on a 2 year contract at 10% interest on an agreed price of $144,000

My buyer will be financing $138,160.00 with me at 10%.
There monthly payment to me will be $1,212.45 PI
There Monthly Tax payment will be $ 145.00 TI

TOTAL $1357.45 Per month

I will still of course be making the mortgage payments from the original seller.
The math:

I still have $15,828.00 tied up in the property.

My buyers payment $1357.45 to Me.
My obligation of $ 927.39 to mortgage and taxes of original seller.

Total of $430.00 a month Positive cash flow
Times 24 months = $10,320

Now I will be paying $927.39 a month for 24 months so the amortization will be:

$101,936.96 at the end of 2 years.

Figuring my buyers amortization will be:
$136,468.99 at the end of 2 years.

Total difference of :

Subtracting $15,828 (what I have invested in buying out original owner and repairs)

Total of: $18,704.03
Subtract capital gains - $ 4,800.00

                                                                              = $13,904.03  

Times 24 month payments over the last 2 years + $10,320.00.
Plus $6000.00 that was the down payment $ 6,000.00

Total profit of $30,224.03 .

I would like any feedback on this that anyone can offer, Good or bad if you think I am an idiot then say so and tell me why. Was I right about capital gains? Did I miss something very important. Tell me if you would write this deal. Please tell me why you wouldnt’.

Sorry it is so long and boring

Thank you for your time.
Jeff, Ohio


In my opinion, this would be a TERRIBLE (hypothetical) deal. Here are the reasons:

  1. In the vast majority of Ohio, people with $1,357 per month don’t rent houses, they buy houses. I’m not saying that you won’t find an occassional renter at this price, but you will have a LOT of vacancy at that rate.

  2. Since people with $1,357 per month don’t simply rent, you’ll likely be forced to “sell” the house via a sandwich lease-option or a land contract (as you proposed in your post). In either case, you’ll have a hard time finding someone with bad credit and $6,000 cash. I have “sold” houses on lease option, and have had a very difficult time finding someone with a $2,000 option premium. Again, you’ll have a lot of vacancy.

  3. Buying subject 2 sounds great on the internet and it does work. I have used it several times when I wanted to operate a property for a few months before actually buying it. However, doing a sandwich lease-option as you are describing is an invitation to disaster. What typically happens is that when your buyer wants to buy, your seller changes his mind and refuses to sell. Then, you’ve got two lawsuits on your hands and a BIG mess.
    Another thing that can happen is that your seller can refinance the property; get a second mortgage; home equity loan; etc. Then, when you want to exercise your option, the agree upon amount won’t pay off the loan.

  4. Another fact that the gurus fail to mention about lease-option is that the vast majority of lease-option buyers don’t end up buying the house. Their credit never improves and the bad habits that caused their initial problems resurface.

  5. The gurus also tell you that lease-option tenants will take better care of the house than a normal tenant. This is not true in most cases. Many people (including homeowners) live like pigs and don’t take care of their property (and certainly won’t take care of your property). Also, once they realize that they won’t be able to buy the house and that you’ve got a $6,000 non-refundable option premium, they may tear the place up just because they’re mad. At this point, they consider themselves a victim who has been cheated out of $6,000 by you. In addition to tearing up your house, they may very well sue you.

  6. I would not buy a house (lease option or not) at such a high percentage of market value. You can buy a house on lease option at 50%, 60%, or 70% of market value instead of 100%. Buying at market value is almost always a mistake in REI.

I could go on and on, but I think you get the idea.