We’re not gonna be a mad max society anytime soon. i think my airline stock will rise a few dollars before i’m wearing a ripped tire over my shoulder as a jacket & holding a crossbow.
the future looks rocky for another 12-18 months and then we will evolve our markets. 1 thing about the bailouts. if they didnt do this last bailout we might have been in the early stages of what you mention. last wednesday our countries credit system stalled. banks would not lend to each other.
if the government didnt act quickly the great depression 2 woulda started.
It wasnt because the market went down significantly, it was to stop an economic meltdown you’re talking about.
REIClub MadMax - “I got (real-estate) skills. I can trade those.”
Bartertown - “Sorry, the brothel’s full!”
HAHAHAHA! :biggrin :biggrin :biggrin :biggrin
Dude, is there any here that can actually look themselves in the mirror and proclaim that the Road Warrior series is anything other than uber cool??
I thought not!
So where is the govt. getting all this money to fund these entitlements, bailouts etc…? It seems to me they’re using foreign debt and tax revenue. That’s like a guy who’s making $30k/ year, but he has “seemingly” limitless credit extended to him because he has a stable job and good credit. The govt.'s stable income is the tax revenues. Their “creditwothiness” is directly related to the confidence level that other countries have in the U.S taxpayer/consumers. It appears we keep adding debt to pay the debt. As long as we can borrow, we can stay afloat. THAT’S when evrything collapses. Just the guys who eventually realizes that his $30k income won’t pay the huge debt he created, or his stable income becomes unstable or is reduced; he files bankruptcy and its game over.
It appears we keep adding debt to pay the debt. As long as we can borrow, we can stay afloat. THAT'S when evrything collapses. Just the guys who eventually realizes that his $30k income won't pay the huge debt he created, or his stable income becomes unstable or is reduced; he files bankruptcy and its game over.
Your analogy is correct, but they’re not borrowing the money - they’re simply “printing it” out of thin air, diluting the value of YOUR money everytime they do it. That is why runaway inflation is an absolute certainty. More phoney dollars means the value of every dollar is decreased.
That’s a good point Mike. The more money you print, the less its worth… Especially when it stopped becoming money and became “currency” when Nixon took it off the “Gold Standard”. But the amount of debt we owe to other countries adds more “snow to the snowball”.
I agree with Propertymanager’s view. I moved my 401K money out of aggressive stock into a GIC fund. I know this selling low but given the state of the economy and all the public and private debt whats a guy supposed to do? I wish I had put it into gold, and I may if I can. I think the stock market will go down more, and then I may buy back into it.
Mike
I seriously wanna beat these FED & Treasury f****** over the head!!! We, the American people cant be that dumb that they wanna pull this over on us… All in the name of fear and “expediency” or the “alternative” will be much worse…
We now get a glimpse at the “Grand” plan… Its to buy these BAD DEBTS at “hold-to-maturity” prices, in other words paying FULL FACE VALUE for a heaping pile of ****!
"Bernanke, putting aside his prepared remarks released earlier today, said the Treasury should buy illiquid assets at hold-to-maturity'' values rather than at discounted fire- sale’’ prices. The suspension of mark-to-market'' accounting for assets, a change backed by many banks,‘’ would instead hurt investor confidence.
The comments are the first indication by both Bernanke and Paulson about the price Treasury is willing to pay financial institutions for toxic assets."
If the people that buy these houses are getting foreclosed on that means they cant afford them, who do we think can really afford them? The people have become overburdened with debt; credit ratings are going in the toilet, life savings are being destroyed. The values wont reach where they were for most likely another 20 years… Thats not a helpful plan… I don’t even see it as stopping the price crash as still people don’t trust the plan
This plan isnt about stopping a price crash. its about keep credit markets working !! if this plan does not go through were in the greatest depression ever.
I dont agree with this maturity value bs either. these banks should take the full brunt of this mess. give them a price that will allow them to still operate but dont give them a profitable solution. these banks should be kept in operation but dont allow them or shareholders to make any profit for almost destroying the country.
its funny because i have had many offers counter or rejected by banks. it seems to me that something is not getting across to these banks. they’re dropping like flies but yet they are trying to squeeze evey last dollar out each property. I think these banks should do a fire sale.
WE bailed out bear stearns then these banks were told you need to raise capital. what do they do ??? nothing, they sit and pray that people start buying house again. take the damn losses you idiots and get money into your company.
instead Rich old uncle sam is depended on to help now. 2,300 per tax payer is what they want to get today. these banks should have to work off this debt to the government in form or another.
we are between a rock and a hard place now with no other solution’s.
We need Ron Paul as president. or atleast a president who will make our #1 priority the Economy for years, not just to get into office. we need a major over-haul of how things are done. I mean a team of economic minds working non-stop to get us off this life support system we have been on for years.
Perhaps they’re thinking the economy will improve and people will “eventually” buy these houses. The banks did NOTHING because they I think they know they have a “Rich Uncle” that will bail them out… Just another entitlemnet menatality… Just a higher price… There should be some serious “head chopping” on Wall St. for every bank that gets bailed out. Starting at the top!
How about the individuals who borrowed too much money and got themselves into a situation they couldn’t afford? Media bashing of the government seems to have taken over as America’s Pastime. Seems easy to just blame the big 'ol govt or whoever else some talking head on TV decides to pass the blame off to for the day. The truth is my neighbors, your neighbors, some people on this board, and many other every day Americans had a huge hand in landing us in this mess. There are entire neighborhoods that are now desolate because people wanted to keep up with their friends and got themselves into too much debt. Do I think the higher-ups at these failed businesses should be compensated on their way out the door? Definitely not!! But you can’t blame these other people in power without the average American taking some type of accountability for their actions. We always want to have someone else to blame, but if a person can’t determine what they can afford they don’t need to be doing the deal in the first place.
You have a point there… the truth is, everybody deserves the blame, it is a chain reaction… there is no debate about that… the only thing debatable is who deserves the biggest blame?
Hey guys… I have a few questions that has REALLY caused all of my family to argue with me.
I am a Libertarian/Conservative, whatever you want to call me… just throwing that out there.
I think most of us would agree that when you own something, you should be able to do WHATEVER you want with stuff you own. If I own a house(no more morgage or loans, I own 100% of it), I should be able to burn it down(as long as I dont try to collect insurance, that would be fraud).
But what about this…
Scenario 1…
Lets say I am a business owner. The business is MINE. Lets say im having a HORRIBLE day. Since it is MINE, do I have the RIGHT to just walk in and fire somebody who has been working for 25 years even if the worker did nothing wrong? I believe I can because it is MINE. Nobody can tell me what I CAN and CANNOT do with something I own. Thoughts?
[b]My dad says no because your quote “selling the F@@@ing Middle Class Americans down the drain with ideas like that. Thats why we have unions, if the constitution thinks if you can do something immoral like that I say burn the constitution”
I am outraged[/b]
Also, I dont know if you people know this. But, if you pay all cash for a vehicle and you get the manufacturers statement of origin, you are not required to have a drivers license or register your vehicle. Might want to look in on that.
Also, what are some thoughts on how good of a president Ronald Reagan was.
You have a point there... the truth is, everybody deserves the blame, it is a chain reaction... there is no debate about that... the only thing debatable is who deserves the biggest blame?
Camilleb,
No, everyone does not deserve the blame - I do not deserve the blame. I pay my bills. I pay my mortgage. I run an honest business that is not being bailed out. I do not deserve the blame. Likewise, the vast majority of Americans do not deserve the blame. They pay their bills on time. They pay their mortgage. The have an honest job or own an honest business and are not being bailed out. They don’t deserve the blame either!
Our politicans who promoted giving home loans to people that should NEVER have been homeowners ARE TO BLAME. The banks who loaned money to people who were a bad risk ARE TO BLAME. The idiots who borrowed the money and couldn’t pay the mortgage ARE TO BLAME. The investors who bought the derivatives related to these bogus mortgages without doing their due diligence ARE TO BLAME! There are clearly people who ARE to blame and there are clearly people who are NOT to blame and it’s easy to identify who is who.
Hoosier,
The purpose of running a business is to MAKE MONEY! Period! The purpose of running a business is not to provide employment or to provide health insurance or to help the poor. So, yes, if the company is suffering and can improve the bottom line by laying people off - that is appropriate. Your father is living in the past, in an entirely different century, when companies in the United States had little competition and when companies took care of their workers. The reality is different in the 21st century. We now are competing on a global level and workers must make themselves indespensible if they want to retain their jobs for a lifetime. Businesses must either compete globally or go out of business!
I wouldn’t buy into the panic of worrying about your money etc…Your money is insured up to $100k and then capco insurance takes over…So you are fully covered up to %100…But the panic is setting in and the blood is in the streets…Don’t throw rocks at me but these times are historically the buy points…You can bet that the blackboxes were kicking out buy signals in every major trading room near today
Capco only covers above 100k if the actual said brokerage is at fault…If the assets held in the said fund depreciate capco does not cover that…Be careful…
Money market rates are soaring…check FTEXX %5.1
And I agree with the mentality with not playing into the gloom and doom but on the other hand I think things get worse…Slightly or not I think we dont have a V bottom at all…
I would encourage everyone that has an opinion on this Bailout to call their congressman (or woman). I’ve been calling mine every day since this crisis started and letting them know that I am against bailing out the Wall Street Fatcats! Obviously, I am not alone and I heard one congressman say today that his calls were running 300 to 1 AGAINST THE BAILOUT! If companies bought bad paper or are overleveraged, they should be allowed to fail. There’s an entrepreneur around every corner and all these Wall Street Firms CAN BE REPLACED! All we need the government to do is GET OUT OF THE WAY!
Economists estimate that there is $400 BN in the private sector just waiting to be invested in the real estate markets when prices go low enough. Economist Nouriel Roubini who predicted IN DETAIL what is happening today, has great insight into the components that any viable solution must include. This is a systemic failure. As of today, the currently proposed bailout package doesn’t address many of the causes of the crisis.
Nouriel Roubini’s website is:
I guess that’s just me.