Did anyone else feel the cold chill during obama’s defending of terrorists,I mean speech today?I think I’m with the past eight years on defense(since we have’nt been attacked).So would anyone explain why you would want to"change" that?How many more terrible decisions must we watch??
Listen, Im all for a non-intervention foreign policy (as our founding fathers said we should have), and Bush and many before him have not been doing that, but with that said, I think it is a joke how these liberals are crying because of torture.
If it takes our CIA to waterboard a terrorist 20 times to get information that could potentionally save one of my family members… your damn right im going to support that.
Obama should have just kept quite about this whole torture thing, and let the CIA do what they were doing.
Its suddenly torture now.Was it torture when clinton had the egyption govt do the same or worse to “enemy combatants”.Besides who are we trying to satisfy by not calling them terrorists?I give this president another 6mnths before his zombies will even figure him out.
Obama simply blows my mind. One day he prides himself in being the sole reason and determining factor for killing 3 Somalian pirates to help the captain, the next day he says waterboarding someone that still lives in the end is torture and we won’t have it.
I gotta say I was damn impressed by Cheney’s speech yesterday, too bad he wasn’t that bold and forthcoming when he was in office…
Jake,
I too have been impressed with his daughter.I have no idea why we did’nt hear from cheney,lord knows bush could’ve used support in his speeches.It’s a shame that what he’s calling for in the full report on what was gained from the "torture"technique will probably never be exposed.
“Torture” and “American” in the same sentence turns my stomach. Freedom from torture just has to be the first human right. The most basic human right.
Think about it, guys. If you wouldn’t want it done to your own family members it should not be done. Period.
Nothing justifies that assault to our national pride, our character, the very principles we were founded on. Torture hurts America. Torture begets torture. That should be one thing we could all agree on.
Thank God we finally have a president who seems to have a moral compass.
Furnishedowner
Ohh jesus… where to begin! Obama is a racist who thinks of himself above others. We all know this.
First, Obama having a moral compass? He supports infanticide, this is a fact, check his voting record.
Also, and I REALLY want you to answer this question. I believe you said you have a daughter if I remember correctly from reading a previous post…
Would you support waterboarding(which IMO is NOT torcher, but interrogation), if it led to them preventing an attack that could possibly kill your daughter? If you say yes, then you cannot say we shouldnt do it for other peoples lives. So which is it… not waterboarding a terrorist, or saving your daughters life? I want an answer.
These are the issues Bush was faced with, and I believe the CIA did a fine job. Obama is going to change this though. Thank god, for his MORAL COMPASS!
Obama’s moral compass, huh. That’s a very interesting statement.
Obama is heartless hiding behind his rhetoric and attempts to twist the truth
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZVf_o1C2nI
Here is the truth of what he feels about killing babies that survived a botched abortion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypDwNpgIUQc
Obamas going to bankrupt the coal industry intentionally for the fraud of man made global warming.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hdi4onAQBWQ&eurl=http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/
Obama wants to ban concealed weapons carry laws. In many states it is illegal to open carry so that means no one could take a gun anywhere, even back from the gun shop to your house.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-4jqZSEo0Q&eurl=http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/
Obama caught lying about handgun ban
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhL8aeIsTEo
Obama has a hard time showing up to work, he should have been fired by the people he is representing but they didn’t know.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ah9W24oMIRc&eurl=http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/
Obamas minister and his hate speeches
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=617eK2XIaLk
Obama agrees with the minister in his own words
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySM63ES8t4U
Rev Wright represents the best of what the black church has to offer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fh7xMhsLnac&eurl=http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/2008_10.php
Obama on spreading the wealth and changing the constitution
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iivL4c_3pck&eurl=http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/2008_10.php
Obama lied about his uncle liberating a concentration camp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhuXPpCGhhM
Obama and the troop surge, his willingness to loose the war to win the presidency
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4XY1SB7FFU
It goes on and on.
It sounds like you may have this mental disease of radical extremist liberalism or you are highly uneducated about the political environment due to the lack of attention reported by the main stream media. I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt and blame it on the media.
Furnishedowner
“Torture” and “American” in the same sentence turns my stomach. Freedom from torture just has to be the first human right. The most basic human right."
That is why you do what you do for a living, and they do what they do… you don’t even have all the information and you’ve already condemned them… :bs
“Think about it, guys. If you wouldn’t want it done to your own family members it should not be done. Period.”
The premise is completely false… waterboarding is NOT torture… do you even really know what this waterboarding entailed? FYI, we “waterboard” Navy Seals, and other members of the military… are you saying we are “torturing” them? I wouldn’t want my family members put in harms way, and I dare say that if you have children, and one of them was in mortal danger, and the only way to save them was to get information from someone, you are telling me you would just sit on your hands and just plead with the person with the knowledge you need while the innocent child, who did NOTHING to cause the situation is harmed? This goes contrary to basic instinct… now put it in perspective and just imagine it on a larger scale…
“Nothing justifies that assault to our national pride, our character, the very principles we were founded on. Torture hurts America. Torture begets torture. That should be one thing we could all agree on.”
You do know that Obama has maintained this SAME practice as an option for HIMSELF, right? If he really disagreed with it, WHY does he need it? Think about it, Obama let’s out the information of HOW we get information from the terrorists, so that they can train against it in the future, but refuses to release the information we got as a result of it?.. WHY? If releasing the photo’s he was going to would “enflame America’s enemies”, WHY release the info on the waterboarding, which only PREPARES and EMBOLDENS our enemies… :banghead :banghead
So now CIA people in the field, and those making the policies to keep us safe, are put in the position of wondering whether or not their country has their back? You don’t think this will lead to innocent deaths?
“Thank God we finally have a president who seems to have a moral compass.”
What moral compass are you referring to? So, you are OK with Obama ordering the KILLING of the terrorists just not “torturing” them… WHAT?.. :rolleyes What exactly would you have the CIA do, just keep questioning them and HOPE they give up the information which may or may not lead to additional deaths?
For the sake of consistency, and to see where you truly are on this… are you saying that you were are OK with Obama ordering the KILLING of the three pirates to save ONE captain, but NOT OK with Bush ordering “waterboarding”, not death, with medical people at the ready, which saved countless other lives?
Furnishedowner, just be glad you aren’t faced with the difficult decisions and situations that these people have to make…
BTW, the terrorists don’t waterboard their captives… they BEHEAD them! They are beyond the Geneva convention, and they are literally LAUGHING at us over this… and THAT turns my stomach!..
Good points Positive!
Here is another nice and comprehensive video of Obama’s moral compass.
http://www.break.com/usercontent/2008/12/Which-Obama-Did-You-Vote-For-614599.html
furnished owner, was your post meant to be sarcastic?, because it was just ridiculous enough that I dont know how you can actually mean what you just said…
Jake,
I think he’s one of those obama zombies and the teleprompter spell will take a little longer to wear off.The bush blame is over and its time for all you zombies to admit your great president does’nt have a clue.Maybe in another six months of transforming us into communism ,they’ll get it.Meanwhile the rest of us who knew he was the wrong guy will suffer along will our country.
Dang. It’s like talking to rabid dogs! That’s why I usually just stick to the real estate forums. Oh well…
You hard-liners are on the fringe. You can all agree with each other that President Obama is a racist (!), a terrorist and supports infanticide. Sorry, but that is all just plain wacky. It is as if you are from some other extreme planet.
I, and the MAJORITY of Americans chose Obama because he appeared to be the best of the bunch. Remember, this is a democracy, or tries to be, and the MAJORITY rules. We voted. I voted. You probably all voted.
Now let’s get behind this smart, well-spoken man and let him have his 4 years. He won the election! He’s doing a hell of a good job in extremely difficult times. If something doesn’t seem to work, he tries something else. The MAJORITY of the country agrees with me on this.
As for waterboarding, hell no, it should not be used and I could not support the use of torture. Don’t you get it? Torture makes the victim say ANYTHING to make it stop. Didn’t any of you watch the Congressional hearings where the government interrogator testified that he sent numerous memos to the Bush administration decrying the use of waterboarding as ineffective? That no new valid information was gathered? That half the information gleaned was bogus and made up just to GET THEM TO STOP? That regular interrogations had already proven effective? That no one in the Bush administration listened?
So no, I could NOT support the use of waterboarding to “help” my daughter, my son, or anyone else. It is medieval, primitive, demeaning to our country. And ineffective.
If we Americans torture members of other religions, nationalities, or extremist groups, WE CAN EXPECT THEM TO TORTURE CAPTURED AMERICANS. We can not stop crazy extremists from beheading people, they also behead their own in-country enemies. But we can stop the horrible international PR about American atrocities that are inflaming every radical everywhere.
If we are civilized, we have to take the high road here. This will make you all froth at the mouth even more, but former Vice President Cheney and some others should be tried as war criminals in my opinion. He sanctioned TORTURE IN THE NAME OF THE UNITED STATES. MY COUNTRY! How dare he!
Above all, that first right. The right for every human being, no matter whom or where or whatever misguided murderous philosophy he may hold…TO BE FREE FROM TORTURE.
Think about it, guys. A lot of you probably go to church every Sunday. How can you reconcile “Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You” with torture? Let’s get back to being Americans. Not barbarians.
Furnishedowner
We need to give the president time to figure out all of the hidden trouble that the past administration has failed to tell him about. As with all new presidents we will not be given the full story until obama is well into his 3rd year and by then it will be a foot note. I believe that both obama and cheney made good points. Cheney in his an eye for an eye agenda and obama with his lock em up for life agenda. torturing the wrong person is not the american way. however when i see what they do to our soldiers I’m with cheney. I can’t help it but i’m torn between both policies because if you speak to the families of service men in this country you will get a different view. If someone tortures my family member by accident though that’s gonna be a BIG problem with me.
First off, America is not a democracy. It is a Republic, or a INDIRECT democracy. We respect minority rights. As in… all of us (the majority) cant say that you, furnished owner, have to give up all your wealth? This would be the majority, picking on a minority. We do not do this. Why? Because we respect minority rights (or were supposed to, which we didnt in the case of taking the CEO money away, unconstitutionally)… but im being picky I guess…
Also, freedom from torcher is not the first right all humans have. The right to life is… which your darling Obama is supporting taking away from millions of babys in the U.S. …
I do not support torcher, as in whipping or something like that, and im sure none of us do. But drowing, since you think its torcher… let me just say this.
We dont have to worry about terrorists drowning our troops, because they mutulate and take off our troops heads… This is not something I make up, it happened to one of my best friends brothers. So dont make it look like TERRORISTS are doing less than drowning.
I say, Waterboard the piss out of these low life scum, and get information out of them that saves people (your daughter, mine, and many other peoples potential life) and then put them through our court of law, and quickly put a 25 cent bullet in there head).
Wow, im insane arent I ? What you all think?
Furnishedowner,
Look at the recent polls by Gallup and CNN, the majority of American SUPPORT waterboarding, and think it was justified in the case of Bush/CIA… So WE are with the majority of this, and this is without context in the media…
And you are completely WRONG… the waterboarding of KSM (Kalik Shiek Mohammed) DID yield intelligence and DID save lives…
GEORGE TENET, CIA Director (DEMOCRACT) - "the “enhanced interrogation” program alone yielded more information than everything gotten from “the FBI, the Central Intelligence Agency and the National Security Agency PUT TOGETHER.”
MICHAEL HAYDEN, CIA director AFTER waterboarding had been discontinued, writes (with former Attorney General Michael Mukasey) that… “as late as 2006 … fully HALF OF THE GOVERNMENT’S KNOWLEDGE about the structure and activities of al-Qaeda CAME from those interrogations.”
Even Dennis Blair, OBAMA’S DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE, [b][i]CONCURS that these interrogations yielded “high value information.” [/b] [/i]
Blair’s predecessor, Mike McConnell, “We have people walking around in this country that are alive today because this process happened.”
So much for the BS that waterboarding does not yield anything… :rolleyes it yielded a h*ll of a lot of information…
So, the CIA, the Bush Administration, the DHS, AND the JUSTICE DEPARTMENT signed off on waterboarding…
Furnishedowner,
The thing that absolutely astounds me is that you say you would sit on your hands and not waterboard someone who was standing in the way of your INNOCENT child being in mortal danger (I never said “help” them as you try to mischaracterize it to make it more palataple, I specifically said - “and one of them was in mortal danger, and the only way to save them was to get information from someone”)? You would not exhaust ALL ways to get this information? You mean you are willing to sacrifice your INNOCENT child for the terrorist? That is some warped logic you have there…
The Geneva convention applies to regular warfare, and was signed on by other countries, but the terrorists do not belong to any of these country’s, are not entitled to Geneva convention protection, and no matter whether or not WE ban “waterboarding” they will absolutely CONTINUE to behead us… so your logic is flawed…
As far as trying to use the religious principle against us - “How can you reconcile “Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You” with torture?” - very simply, we DO NOT behead them when captured just BECAUSE they are who they are… they are SPARED their life when they are captured, and GAIN WEIGHT in captivity… So we, by definition ALREADY treat them better… so why are you not asking the same questions of the terrorists? After all, they will NEVER stop beheading, so why the different standard for Americans, using your religous example?
That being said, Furshishedowner… OBAMA HAS RETAINED THE RIGHT OF WATERBOARDING FOR HIMSELF!
And you never answered the question about how OBAMA - “…are you saying that you were are OK with Obama ordering the KILLING of the three pirates to save ONE captain (without trial that you want to provide TERRORISTS), but NOT OK with Bush ordering “waterboarding”, not death, with medical people at the ready, which SAVED countless other lives?”
As I said before the zombies that can’t see past the well crafted teleprompted speeches will have to see four years of bad decisions to turn on the hollywood actor we now have as president.So while the messiah spends away our childrens future and freedom trying to solve all those evil bush years,we all will just wait along with the zombies to see if any of this will sink into their thick heads as BAD FOR THE COUNTRY!!!
Furnishedowner,
I am shocked at your radical statements. It is actually you that is fringe but you must not think so because you share the opinion of the government media complex.
“”“You hard-liners are on the fringe. You can all agree with each other that President Obama is a racist (!), a terrorist and supports infanticide. Sorry, but that is all just plain wacky. It is as if you are from some other extreme planet.”“”
It’s funny how all of the people here are in agreement but you. But you think that that is a coincidence? Or is it more likely that you are on the fringe?
“”“You can all agree with each other that President Obama…supports infanticide”“”
You radical leftists seem to have a hard time actually understanding what Obama is saying. Or maybe you people love him so much that whatever he says negative is blocked out. Ok, I will post it again for you. Now you tell me after listening to this audio, straight out of the horses mouth, that he doesn’t support killing babies from a botched abortion.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypDwNpgIUQc
And here is an angel who survived a botched abortion. Do you really agree with Obama that this beautiful person should have been killed because it would have gone against the original decision to abort her? If you agree with Obama than you are one of the most heartless people I have ever talked to.