From your own website:
"Our NARS Equity Holding Trust Fee Schedule:
Simple Trusts $199
NARS/NEHtrust 1% of MAV
Trustee Fee .5% of MAV per year divided by 12 (minimum $40/month)
Also, for PAC/NEHtrusts you will be charged for the following…
Private Consulting Call Gary"
Call me stupid, but the words “OUR…Fee Schedule” and the reference to “you will be charged” in the additional fees for PAC/NEHtrust. Suggests to me that YOU are charging the reader, not paying fees for them.
“Our” Fee Schedule refers to North American Realty Services, Inc., founders of the NARS Trust, of which I am a Network Member and Certified Trust Consultant. My membership information is on the “About Us” page. NARS charges the fees, not me. They include accounting and legal review. There is nowhere on my website for you to pay me.
As to what the page says, you left a lot out: Creative financing/Asset management/protection consulting. I’ve done this for many years.
Also: Joint venture participation considered (10% Beneficiary Interest). If someone wants to do a deal using a land trust but doesn’t have a clue as to how to do it, I will joint venture with them and take care of the asset management for 10%. I have never charged anyone to “do a trust”. Why would I want to, when my tenant will pay the cost? End of story.
Hey,
I agree with Bobo. Therre has been far to much confrontation, etc. on this site of late and it is tiring and, frankly, quite unnecessary. It really isn’t how many deals you have done with what method where and to who. It helps if your surgeon has done 1000 surgeries as opposed to one, perhaps. But, if he has done 1000 but nobody in the whole world is doing it that way then perhaps his way isn’t best (yet, nno less valid if the surgeries are successful). The point is this: if the methodology is supported by the works and doings of others then it is valid. It doesn’t matter is the one doing the recommending has done one or a hundred deals that way - the fact that others are doing so validates the method. Each can have an opinion over methodology. Each can express the pros/cons of each methodology. Allow the rest of us to use our own intelligence and knowledge of our own situation to decide for ourselves. Personal attacks are not needed nor appreciated by the rest of us. This isn’t a smack-down forum or the OK corral.
IMHO.
Peace,
Richard
Richard. Thank you.
Personally I have learned more when these two guys start fighting than I have just reading all the threads.
Which method provides the least liability for me? I am a licensed real estate broker in california but am a loan officer although I don’t operate a real estate office per se.
My worry due to licensing and work history, I qualify as an expert. Doing Trusts/subject 2’s or lease options is not an area I am familiar with so obviously I am NOT an expert. Unfortunately if I ever get called into court, the buyers or sellers can say they trusted me because of my license. If the buyer cant get approved for a loan in the future, no matter what I have told him or had him sign, I can still end up in a lawsuit.
Real estate classes teach the legal aspects of these devices but not the real life application. Cash and Gary have real life experience but are not licensed so avoid the liability I have. They can always say they are posting for informational purposes only and always recommend conferring with an attorney or licensed broker (me) for legal advice.
So my basic question and worry is “how clean is this stuff”? Give me the downside as you see it because the California market is ripe for these creative methods.
Hi Thailandave,
Glad you asked. The North American Realty Services (NARS) Trust program is approved by the California Dept. of Real Estate – Continuing Education Cert.#3309. It was developed by Bill Gatten in California in 1984, and the NARS office is located in California. Of 3500+ members, many are realtors and lenders. No downside in California.
You mention the buyer getting approved in the future. In the NARS Trust, the buyer is an owner of the trust (personal property) and therefore entitled by the IRS to writeoff the interest and taxes. As an owner, he is able to refinance at the end of the lease, rather than have to go through the stricter parameters of a purchase loan. Good luck to you.
Da Wiz
thailanddave,
Glad to meet you.
You are in an excellent position, being a Realtor and Mortgage Banker to do creative deals. First you know who is not able to bail out and needs to when applying for a loan these folks would be your primary target market.
Now all you have to do is help them, but taking off the Conventional hat and putting on the Creative hat is the real challange. I have students in California who are in the same position you are in and it all boils down to disclosure, disclosure, disclosure.
No matter what method you use when it comes law suit time it is he said she said, however if you have the proper disclosure paperwork at least you will have the upper hand.
By the way did I mention what (NARS) stands for Not All Realtors Survive this method of investing.
Judgement call on your part and the best of luck with it.
John $Cash$ Locke
Hey ThailandDave,
I’m in exactly the same position as you, involved in both mortgage lending and REI. As such, I definitely feel the need to be 10 feet tall and bulletproof, John Wayne style.
Perhaps I take asset protection to the utmost extreme, but you can’t buy hazard insurance when the house is on fire, right?
There are many different creative acquisition/ exit strategies available. All objectives may be met through a well crafted land trust. The NARS Trust itself is simply a title holding device that minimizes liabilities, protects all parties involved from untoward actions of the others and shields the underlying asset. Point is, it’s just a safer way to get 'er done and protect myself. Plus, if a resident is in one of my properties, I get the loan.
Welcome to the group.
Regards,
Dave
PS. You’ll see $Cash$ and Da Wiz going at each other continually. Not for the meek or timid…lol
Dave,
Are you sure the “Duke” didn’t come up with the NARS trust?
John $Cash$ Locke
You’re right, it was the “Duke”. It was his sidekick, Gabby Hayes, that created subject 2’s.
Da Wiz
Gary,
Gabby was Roy Rogers sidekick, not the Duke’s, however if that is the case then Trigger came up with NARS, however he is stuffed now over in Bakersfield so you can still see the originator, should you need to pay homage.
John $Cash$ Locke
Your grey matter must be deteriorating, John. Gabby starred with John Wayne in many movies including:
American Legend
Angel & the Badman
Riders of Destiny
The Sagebrush Trail
West of the Divide
The Man From Utah
Hell Town
Texas Terror
The Trail Beyond
The Dawn Rider
just to name a few. :
: : : : : : I always enjoy educating you.
Da Wiz
Gary,
He was not a sidekick in these movies, The Man from Utah (1934) here are some quotes from the movie.
Marshal George Higgins (Gabby Hayes): It seems mighty funny to me that every time NARS spams a discussion board, their own men win all the first prizes.
John Weston (John Wayne): Well, you can’t arrest them for that, Marshal.
Marshal George Higgins: No, maybe not. But it’s might peculiar that when these outsiders fall off this method of investing, they’re suffering from snakebite. I tell ya, it just ain’t natural.
John Weston: What do you want me to do try this method? Get snake bit?
John $Cash$ Locke
John, the wonderful thing about these message boards is that there is a lot of knowledge and information available, especially to the “newbies” whom we both try very hard to help. There are many people who post valuable information, all smart in their own way. However, we often try to outsmart one another so I’m offering this test to the forum experts:
TRY THIS:
How smart is your right foot?
This will boggle your mind and you will keep trying it at least 50 more times to see if you can outsmart your foot. But you can’t!!!
While sitting at your desk, lift your right foot off the floor and make clockwise circles with it.
Now while doing this, draw the number 6 in the air with your right hand. Your foot will change direction!!! I told you so, and there is nothing you can do about it.
Just a little item to show us all that we are just human, no matter how smart we think we are.
Have a nice day
Da Wiz
Gary,
Sounds like from what you described as someone trying to do a NARS deal. No matter how hard you try…
You have a wonderful day also,
John $Cash$ Locke
Hey,
What I can’t figure out is how that right foot ends up in both of you guys mouth at times.
Peace,
Richard
Richard,
That’s only if you make a “6” in the air. If you make a “9”, it’s the left foot.
Peace
Da Wiz
Hey,
Well, that explains a lot. I went back and read your instructions because I kept falling down and hurting myself. “While sitting at your desk” - I was standing up.
Peace,
Richard
I have a couple questions about the trust. I think I have a pretty good understanding of L/P. Its not that I am dissing the L/P, its just I don’t have a question…
In the NAR, you have the trustor (seller), trustee, and benficiary (buyer/occupant). Where do I fit in this if I am setting up the whole thing. Do I just charge a fee for setting it up or can I share in ownership as a beneficiary?
Im assuming I cant set up a 2nd trust becuz I really don’t own anything other than rights.
It was Walter Brennan with the Duke…Gabby was with Roy.
Dave,
There would be another party in the transaction, the IB Investor Beneficiary.
SB 10%, IB 40%, RB 50%. The sellers interest reverts to the IB at termination. The trustee is never a beneficiary in the trust for liability reasons; his (third party non profit corporation) sole function is to safely hold title and take orders from the beneficiaries.
Regards,
Dave