I’ve talked to a few people whom have said that if it wasn’t to bandit signs that they wouldn’t have made it in the beginning. Some people don’t come into the game with boatloads of cash to invest. Even YOU Michael can’t argue that they are cheap and if done right can be ONE way to enter the industry. All it takes is one sale and you have the $$ to implement a “system” and multiple marketing avenues. You may have not had a good response using them, but others have. Also, you can automate your bandit sign campaign by hiring a high school kid to place signs. So for you to say they people are stupid for using them makes you look like as ASS.
It seems that every time that I come on the see what’s new and someone has asked a question you and a hand full of other self proclaimed experts seem to know how to answer a question in a way to self promote yourself as a bad ass REI. Nobody cares!
Heck I was so broke when I started,… So broke I didnt want to answer the phone because I knew it would be a bill collector…
And I have never put up a bandit sign… I have bought my fair share of houses because of them… As for being a bad as Real estate investor come on… I leave bad ass for people like Tyson, Holyfield and Locke…
As for automation… Now youre promoting child labor… Too funny…
It is nice to see you grew a set finally…
PS… I didnt say using bandit signs is stupid I said the statement that bandit signs are the cheapest forms of leads is stupid… Its Stupid…
As for those of us who promote… Never mind I dont want to make you take another shower…
MIchael "You clearly do not know what youre talking about… However for the record YES I do have something to sell… In fact one of the books I wrote includes 101 ways to advertise for sellers as a real estate investor… And OMG I even included bandit signs as one of the methods… "
I don’t know what I’m talking about Michaell? Let’s test your theory. Can you tell me what advice I’ve given on how to use bandit signs properly that is “inaccurate”, “incorrect” or flat out wrong Michael? I do know you are selling a product that is in competition with bandit signs, your signature tells that much. So I guess I’m 1-0. You mentioned earlier that you used bandit signs or so you claimed. I guess you miss the purpose of my being on this forum. I’m not here to brand myself the king of marketing or the guru of most homes bought and sold, you have already claimed that crown, and I hope you have fun wearing it. People on REICLUB are adults, People are going to use any form of maketing they think will help their business. People know the ordinances in their cities, they are once again adults not children. They can make up their minds as adults to whether they want to use bandits signs for marketing nor not. What I say and what other do is irrelevant Michael, because at the end of the day “people can make up their own minds and form their own opinions”.
Michael “Youre one of those that because you do it, it must be the way to do it… Where in reality you believe that because you haven’t opened that thing between your ears enough to consider other methods of marketing and buying houses.”
Strike 2 Michael. I said in an earlier post “different strokes for different folks”. Those words hold meaning. If Direct Mail marketing works for you, once again MORE POWER TO YOU!! I said in an earlier post that people should have “multiple” forms of marketing and not rely on just one form! All you have to do Michael is reread my posts on bandit signs. You will never believe me just by my words, I will video tape my business and you can see for yourself that I use direct mail also and I know of what I speak.
Michael "Your statement “bandit signs are the cheapest cost per lead generator out there” is the dumbest thing I have read on this board in a long time. The problem is that new investors read your crap and think its true when clearly you have no idea what youre talking about. "
Yesterday, I mailed 100 letters and 100 postcards on my rent court list. My list consisted of a second mailing on one of my lists from October. That came to $73 for that week!! So I spent $73 dollars for week to get the attention of 200 people. Normally I get about 3 to 5 calls from my mailings per week. My mailing expense is going to be higher next week, because I have to mail out my probate letters. Now lets look at bandit signs. I can buy 100 18x24 signs for $155 dollars. My per cost for week of using the signs is $38.75 my per sign cost is $1.50. I’ll be ultra conservative with my numbers. Lets say that I only get 10 calls a week from the 25 signs. It only costed me $3.85 per lead! The same 10 lead from direct mail campaign would cost me $7.30 per lead. That’s almost double. Since you are a champion of direct mail Michael, you know perfectly fell that direct mail really doesn’t start to work until you start mailing to a particular list multiple times. Now if I’m wrong in what I’m saying, just say so. When you have to be faithful to remailing to an existing list on top of mailing out on a new list for that week, the costs do start to mount up. Using bandit signs is a fixed cost. I have to admit I was wrong about something. It isn’t $1.50 to use bandit signs. I buy 36 inch stakes at lowes for $9.99. So actually its more like $2.00 per sign because the wooden stakes are about 40 cents each in a bundle of 25. It’s still a fixed cost. Now you tell me and everybody that mailing and remailing multiple lists is less expensive then using bandit signs Michael, and do it with a straight face.
Michael “New investors rely on a bandit sign too much and do not put enough time and energy into creating systems to duplicate their business. tying a 18x24 inch red and yellow sign to a pole is not creating a business model that will flourish… It will influence your decisions and fool you into thinking that you are actually doing something when in reality after months when those signs haven’t worked well enough you give up real estate and decide to go sell amway instead…”
Me and you agree. :beer There are people who do rely on Bandit Signs as a crutch aka their only lead generator. A lot of newbie investors and wholesalers never even heard of direct mail marketing for motivated sellers. I will be the first to admit that using bandit signs alone isn’t the end all to cure all. No company relies on just one form of marketing. I use bandit signs, because I can reach sellers that direct mail can’t. But I cover my bases. Some investors actually advertise in the yellow pages. I dont’ understand why they would pay over $900 a month in order to attract motivated sellers, that’s even if they attract them at all. I know two wholesalers that advertise on a radio station I always listen too. To me I think they are spending way to much money to reach such a narrow audience, but they always have deals to sell at the monthly reia meetings, so it must be working for them. Once again, more power to them. As for Amway, nah Michael. I think that will be more of your speed :biggrin I’m still waiting for you to create that 3am informerical on how your mentorship and letters are going to make some newbie the next Donald Trump. :bobble You just might be the next Tom Vu Michael. One letter at a time. :beer
Michael "There are only three main aspects of this business… Lead generation, lead capture and lead fulfillment… If any one of them are lacking you are not in business. YOUR PLAYING BUSINESS… "
Ok I’ll bite, how do a person “play business” Michael? It doesn’t matter what form of marketing any of us use, it is still MARKETING!! Of course marketing can’t close nor negotiate deals. Have you ever had a seller that just said “here’s my property” just because you sent him or her a letter? Bandit Signs, Direct Mail, Billboards, Radio Ads, Television Spots are just marketing period and nothing more.
Michael "When you advertise you must do so in a fashion that creates dependable responses… Most investors think “If I could make a extra 100k a year investing I would be rich” Why not think “If I could create systems that make me and extra 100k a year I would be rich”
I thought you were rich Michael!!! Dam, I want my money back. You’ve done hundreds of deals and you aren’t retired in Florida hanging out with Carleton Sheets yet? Don’t tell me you invested all your profits in AIG or Enron stock!! :arrow
Michael "I will take the second one every day… The perfect business is one that doesn’t rely on the owners of it to flourish… When you get there you too will understand how stupid of a comment you made… "
So my statement in which I said that it is best to have multiple marketing sources and not be reliant on just one source for leads is stupid Michael? OK thanks for sharing. I like to think that it isn’t stupid but makes perfect sense. That’s just me though.
Michael "As for cookies… They arent on my diet… Donate mine to a charity of your choice… "
Come Michael, these are diet cookies. Tis the season of giving is it not? :biggrin
Youre still full of crap when you say Bandit signs are the cheapest for of lead generation…
Heck direct mail for the dollar spent doesnt even come close to the ROI of TV… Not too mention full page color ads in the newspaper… Anyone ever spend 5k on a full page ad? http://www.hometext.us/untitled.JPG
As for infomercials… I actually have one… Its a half hour about buying your house… Works great at 6:30 drive times. You have to be in the single digit station numbers however…
As for knowing anything … Heck I am dumber then dirt… Learning every day…
Did you know that people who don’t take things seriously tend to live longer Michael? I heard that a few years ago, So I tend to take things in stride. As for me being full of crap when I said bandit signs are the cheapest form of marketing, you didn’t dispute my numbers, Michaels, How come Michael? Deep down, I believe you know I’m right. You do have an infomerical. I didn’t even need to ask Sister Cleo about that one lol Just out of curiosity, what is your cost to lead for your informerical? Don’t even get me started on Newspapers. I wasted money for six weeks putting ads in the Baltimore Sun under in the Real Estate section under the Real Estate Wanted area. I got a grand total of 6 calls for six weeks of advertising!! Five lines for $53.50!! Probably 10 years ago, the newspapers were one of the top lead generators around. Not anymore. This is how pissed off I am at my newspaper response or lack there of . For $53.50 a week, I could have sent out 118 direct mail letters or a 191 post cards a week to a targeted list and got a much better response rate. When my ad was the only one in the paper, that should have told me that other investors aren’t advertising in the paper for a reason. Oh well, live and learn and I definitely paid to learn that leason.I never spend five large on full page ad. I still cry tears when I have to buy forty five cent stamps for my letters. Hey Michael, in your informerical, do you have any women in bikinis? If you do, you have to hook me up with a copy. ;D
You should never put an ad in the real estate wanted section… Should should have bought my 101 ways to advertise and save a bucket load… lol
And why are you spending 44 cents on stamps… OMG… … Stamps only cost 22 cents… Done correctly… But you wouldnt know that cus you’re too busy spending 44 cents… Heck I mail the entire piece for less than that…
The reason youll never spend money on advertising that works is because you have a limited mind frame…
As for living longer or shorter… We all die… Its the ones who die with the most toys that win…
I said you are the guru for a reason Michael. So how are you able to send mail for only 22 cents? Are you sending your mail standard or using bulk? You are going to get a side chuckle from what I’m about to tell you. Today in my traveling through Baltimore, I came across some down right ugly hand written yellow bandit signs. The signs were ugly to begin with, and how he or she had them bunched together at intersections was an eye soar. For the first time ever, I actually entertained the idea of calling code enforcement to have them picked up just because of ghetto value of how they were done and presented. Now that I think about it, I should take some pictures of them, just to show people who use bandits what NOT TO DO. I can tell that the person doing it is a one trick pony when it comes to marketing. Anyways, one of my new postcards is getting a 5% response rate on initial mailings. I’m pretty impressed with the results so far.
You buy them in roles of 500 or 3000 cost is .10 each… You then need a bulk permit that cost 185 annually. You then will pay the difference between .213 Local .273 out of area and the .10 cents already paid…
That isn’t a bad price at all! Even factoring in the annual permit cost, that alone only costs $15.40 a month. Since 95% of my mailings are local, that really would save me some marketing dollars.I have been throwing away money unnecessary. So Michael, do I ask to speak to the my local areal post office supervisor or do I just go to usps.com?
Thanks Michael, you are a guru’s guru. :beer :biggrin Oh one more thing Michael, I have different letters for frustrated landlords and other of town owners. Do you recommend I print those on yellow paper as oppose to regular white paper. I’ve also tried to find yellow #10 envelopes that are sold in large numbers, no such luck. Here’s one of my tricks that I’ve used to get my letters on opened. In my mailings to frustrated landlords, All my letters have a red stamp that reads right above their name on the left hand side
TENANTS SUCK!
APPROVED
I figured using the words TENANTS SUCK would hit their hot button and it has worked well. The whole point is to get them to open the letter. My response using my letters with this stamp message has been way better then when I send out postcards.
I personally don’t like bandits sign either, but I still use them because I get leads
but, another thing you might consider If you don’t want to put bandit signs because you worried about getting fined. You can get flyers about 250-500
and start walking your target area staple a rubber band on it so you can just walk and
hang them on the door knob, or You can get somebody to do it for, in my area there is a guy that does that for me very cheap. But I do it too; I call it getting paid to exercise. You just have to look at it that way. Killing to bird with one stone of course there is plenty of other way but that should get result…by the way I do 500 hundred flyer each week be persistent
You’ve done hundreds of deals and you aren’t retired in Florida hanging out with Carleton Sheets yet? Don’t tell me you invested all your profits in AIG or Enron stock!! :arrow