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Author Topic: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...  (Read 9130 times)

PositiveOutlook

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I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« on: January 11, 2009, 11:28:49 am »
Obama - "George, I want to be realistic here, not everything that we talked about during the campaign are we going to be able to do on the pace we had hoped"...

"Everybody’s going to have to give. Everybody’s going to have to have some skin in the game," Obama said.  - (You would've thought they would've waited to get into office before backpedaling...)

http://blogs.abcnews.com/george/2009/01/obama-calls-for.html

This is just a preview of things to come...  They are railing against the current economics problems and are getting ready to exacerbate them by TRILLION dollar deficits....  So their answer to record debt and deficits is to create MORE record debt and deficits!...  Only to double and triple it!

Now mind you, none of the projections for this TRILLION dollar deficit for fiscal year 2009 AND BEYOND include the massive takeover of 1/7th of the economy - healthcare.  Nor does it take into account the hundreds of thousands of new government jobs (upwards of 600,000) Obama wants to create. 

Nor does it take into account the TAXATION of ALL (individual and businesses) in the form of "carbon credits" being perpetuated under the guise of "global warming" in the face of the record cold-temps and snowfall all over the globe, and the now rising alternate theory that we are entering into another ice-age and the earth has been cooling over the past decade.  Despite the fact that they cannot predict the weather patterns 6-months out (remember 2008 was supposed to have record hurricanes), we are relying on them to forecast the weather patterns 10-years and beyond, and create fiscal policy based on it that will last forever and negatively impact the worlds economy.  If they could actually predict the weather patterns correctly, they wouldn't have went from us entering into an ice-age in the 70's then completely reverse course and push global warming over the past two decades to now going back to the ice age theory. 

Instead of being incensed by this gross misuse and mismanagement of the taxes they now extract from us, we are now being sold a bigger boondoggle, just like a few months ago, there will be no debate, hearing, accountability...

Like lemmings over a cliff...
« Last Edit: January 15, 2009, 10:47:26 pm by PositiveOutlook »

Offline Mdhaas

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2009, 09:23:56 pm »
What's the big deal?

Sounds to me like politics as usual.  :rolleyes
If at first you don't succeed.....................skydiving is not for you

PositiveOutlook

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2009, 09:53:21 pm »
Well, that's certainly one way to look at it...   :rolleyes   So much for "change we can believe in"...


Offline propertymanager

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2009, 06:52:07 am »
Well said PositiveOutlook!!!  Unfortunately, we're not going to get out of this mess without a total collapse of our economy and our country.  We have lived through the best years of the United States, and it's all downhill from here.  While the rest of the world is lowering taxes and pushing back against carbon credits, the socialists want to raise taxes and initiate carbon credits.  It's total insanity and we know how it will end (in disaster).

Mike
www.1MinuteToRentalPropertyRichs.com 
This No-Hype, No-Nonsense Book is a step by step course in making money and building wealth with rental properties!  Everything from buying properties at a discount to dealing with terrible tenants.  Now In Paperback!

Offline phlemboy

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2009, 08:53:21 am »
Perhaps a good stock would be Smith & Wesson!! I'm seriously worried about the kind of country we're leaving for our kids. As far as Obama, I'm witholding judgement until he has some time to earn his reputation ( good or bad). Meanwhile, the only thing we can do is hunker down get/keep our own financial houses in order regardless of what happens.
"Fat drunk and stupid is no way to go through life son." --Dean Wermer

Offline rookieNYC

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2009, 10:33:41 am »
Obama has his work cut out..So far I like his picks for his cabinet but I do have to agree that he is backpedaling *bigtime*..Not that its a surprise,every politician does it but for some reason he had people believing his silky speeches..He will have no choice than to cut taxes and increase the deficit by %100,exactly the opposite of what he promised..In his defense we are in trying times but he did promise change and we will not see an ounce of change for years to come..Like I said before I'm unsure if he has a real choice..

My main concern is the inflation that will emerge in the years to come from all this money being printed...There will be no way to pay down these deficits without the Fed *drastically* raising interest rates in the years to come...Keep a heavy stockpile of cash..

Offline John_in_NC

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2009, 09:05:35 am »
Rookie, everything made sense to me until you said "keep a heavy stockpile of cash"

Why would you want to keep liquid only to watch your dollars turn into toliet paper? Would you not be better borrowing dollars today to buy assets that keep up with inflation, such as gold and real estate, and repay them with toliet paper tommorrow?

Offline rookieNYC

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2009, 03:43:46 pm »
Why would you want to keep liquid only to watch your dollars turn into toliet paper? Would you not be better borrowing dollars today to buy assets that keep up with inflation, such as gold and real estate, and repay them with toliet paper tommorrow?


Toilet paper?..What effect do you think all of this printing of trillions of dollars will have in the future?..INFLATION...Yes Gold may be a good inflation play,or for that matter stocks do very well in inflationary times..But who wants that kind of exposure to that kind of volatility...I'm sorry for not being more clear..I'm in the *staying rich* business...Not in the getting rich business..I'd rather take a guaranteed return once the fed has to start aggressively raising than expose myself to extreme volatility..I'm unsure if you are privy to the kind of pullbacks gold can produce..VIOLENT...Can gold go higher,very possibly but like I said I don't want the risk exposure..And keep in mind that cash is always king,dont buy into the worthless dollar BS...Dr.Doom said it best...Its better to keep your capital free from loss than to risk losing half of it over the next 12 months...So what if you dont earn a huge return,more likely than not you will get caught and get caught badly..

Ask any wealthy person who has had their nuts kicked in 2008 equity markets  if they would rather have back their *worthless* dollars...You bet every single one would take back those worthless dollars...I for one am keeping an immense amount of cash *dry* and ready but I do have some exposure...I bought about 11 different bond funds into the end of 2008..My stops are in place but I'm up nicely so far but once the Fed turns the corner the effect will be huge..He will have no choice but to raise like a bully at a poker table..We are in for more than just a recession..You cant print trillions of dollars and not expect a tsunami of inflation down the line..And considering the banking environment right now I wouldnt expect there will be any money to made on the refi side..Because why refi something that will most likely appraise for a lower amount hence taking in less money..Then if its a commercial mortgage the rates Ive seen are nothing special..I think the right play is you have *ALOT* of cash is to buy good income properties all cash and skip the bank..I know this site touts leverage as being king but i dont agree..Leverage is what put this country in this crisis and banks are not giving money away like they use to..Are they lending,ofcourse but who wants more debt..the name of the game is free and clear and liquid..Not in debt up to your eyeballs holding assets that are declining in value..Everyone has their own way of doing things...

Offline sunnyskyinvestor

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2009, 01:35:09 am »
Let this guy become President first! I think he's keeping his cards close to his vest because BUSH can and has created executive orders effectively prevent anything Obama wants to do immediately. Bush's EO's will already delay stem cell research (for example). Every day a new challenge comes up for this guy. I'd rather plans adjust to the situation instead of sticking with ideologies. Bush did not properly respond to signals and now were faced with the reality of things and Obama (who's not even president yet is taking the heat).

I hear the argument about inflation but what about wages going up along with it? Isn't this the best case scenario? There are innovative ideas out there...there is always something new on the horizon.

Positive Outlook -- you clearly do not live in a big city, like LA. Whether or not you believe in global warming, I assure you we are in great need of clean air and water in our country. You don't even need to live in LA. I lived in Hawaii for 6 of the last 8 years and every year I'd come back to the mainland and the haze over the cities would get worse and it started to spread over my rural hometown in Louisiana. Not kidding -- it is awful and irresponsible on our part. Something can be done about it and must be done.

If it creates new economy -- even better. I equate this time with computers when EVERYONE said "no way a computer would be in everyone's house" ---or the internet?  Those with vision got very rich. The rest of us bought their computers.

Offline phlemboy

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2009, 08:57:46 am »
Wages don't necessarily rise with inflation. We've seen what happens when something like oil goes up. Anything attached to oil prices rises too. This happened all in the face of a recession and massive job losses in 2008. Oil has come down, but things like groceries and other staple items seem to stay at their inflated levels. I feel it every time I make those purchases. Some things like gas & heating oil came down. That actually helps a lot. I get the feeling that we won't see any tangible improvements in the economy until late 09 or early 2010.
"Fat drunk and stupid is no way to go through life son." --Dean Wermer

PositiveOutlook

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2009, 09:44:56 am »
sunnyskyinvestor - Here's an example of the over-selling of global-warming and the knee-jerk reaction it creates from the sensitive...  You automatically assume that because I postulate that the "experts" cannot accurately predict 6 months out correctly the weather patterns, but are ready to implement long-range policy based on faulted science, that I am some-how "pro-pollution".  You're right, I want to breath bad air...  :rolleyes


These are now the same people want to perpetuate the fraud of "carbon credits"... like someone paying money to "offset" their carbon use gets rid of the so-called carbon! That just benefits those who can afford to pay for it, because of their ill-obtained "guilt".  They can "feel" like they did  something.  But what about the majority of citizens for whom this TAX will affect.  Not only in the cost of their electric use, but it's reverberation through the enconomy in the increase of of prices for goods and services.

I believe that recycling is good, I believe alternate energy is good, and just as recycling eventually took hold, I believe that alternate energy sources will do the same.

What I am AGAINST is the fraud being perpetuated on people in order to EXTRACT more and more money from them, reducing their freedom, making them economic slaves to the goverment and thus reliant on the government for their needs as opposed to themselves.

20 Years ago, global warming was being pushed as inevitable, (after they did an about face on a coming ice age in the 70's), but these same people who want to SELL you on global warming were not predicting the cooling period we have been witnessing over the last DECADE (now making some going back to the ice age theory), AND THEY WERE GROSSLY WRONG!  Yet, you are ready and willing to just take what they say as fact.... there's a reason why there is a term - sheeple....

And yet, we have a guy enterig the oval office who has "vowed to end global warming denial"...

He not only has a willing media, but both houses of Congress to perpetuate this fraud.... and THIS doesn't concern you?
« Last Edit: January 15, 2009, 10:40:43 am by PositiveOutlook »

Offline sunnyskyinvestor

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2009, 01:16:48 am »
So we can agree that the "carbon credits" are bogus and that we need to clean things up with innovative technologies. I equate the green movement(my preferred term)/fight global warming to building Hoover Dam. A person who pumped water from a well in 1920 would have definitely objected to tax dollars funding the construction of the dam but that investment paid off big time.

You've just summarized the last 8 years for me.... "the fraud being perpetuated on people in order to EXTRACT more and more money from them (PHONY WAR, OIL SPEC, GREED -- hello deficit for my children to pay), reducing their freedom (FEAR MONGERING), making them economic slaves to the goverment (BAILOUTS/WALL STREET EXCESS) and thus reliant on the government for their needs as opposed to themselves (WE CAN'T HELP OURSELVES ANYMORE -- THE GOVERNMENT JUST TOOK ALL OF OUR MONEY!".

Global warming may be the terminology people need to hear to act -- you know, the crisis response. I'm more concerned about the sheeple who believed it was okay to take BILLIONS overseas wars but are unwilling to lay the groundwork for substantial advancements in technology and innovation. It almost takes that to affect any changes. 

Now call me a sheeple if you want, I do believe global warming is happening. People who live in the US where there are now record cold temps automatically say "no global warming -- just look at this!" But America is not the only place on the map. The problem is that there is extreme HEAT going on somewhere else on the planet at the same time. I do believe the system is out of balance. When it was record cold in Chicago 2 days ago it was almost 90 degrees here in LA -- RECORD heat. Please come to LA in August with all the lovely smog --- it is like an oven these last 2 years -- long time residents vouch for this change the weather.




Offline jfpen

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2009, 01:53:34 am »
So we can agree that the "carbon credits" are bogus and that we need to clean things up with innovative technologies. I equate the green movement(my preferred term)/fight global warming to building Hoover Dam. A person who pumped water from a well in 1920 would have definitely objected to tax dollars funding the construction of the dam but that investment paid off big time.

You've just summarized the last 8 years for me.... "the fraud being perpetuated on people in order to EXTRACT more and more money from them (PHONY WAR, OIL SPEC, GREED -- hello deficit for my children to pay), reducing their freedom (FEAR MONGERING), making them economic slaves to the goverment (BAILOUTS/WALL STREET EXCESS) and thus reliant on the government for their needs as opposed to themselves (WE CAN'T HELP OURSELVES ANYMORE -- THE GOVERNMENT JUST TOOK ALL OF OUR MONEY!".

Global warming may be the terminology people need to hear to act -- you know, the crisis response. I'm more concerned about the sheeple who believed it was okay to take BILLIONS overseas wars but are unwilling to lay the groundwork for substantial advancements in technology and innovation. It almost takes that to affect any changes. 

Now call me a sheeple if you want, I do believe global warming is happening. People who live in the US where there are now record cold temps automatically say "no global warming -- just look at this!" But America is not the only place on the map. The problem is that there is extreme HEAT going on somewhere else on the planet at the same time. I do believe the system is out of balance. When it was record cold in Chicago 2 days ago it was almost 90 degrees here in LA -- RECORD heat. Please come to LA in August with all the lovely smog --- it is like an oven these last 2 years -- long time residents vouch for this change the weather.

For your reading pleasure:

http://www.globalwarminghoax.com/news.php

JP

PositiveOutlook

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2009, 12:52:21 pm »
sunnyskyinvestor - your regurgitation of mediaspeak - "phony war, OIL SPEC, GREED" just shows your lack of geopolitcal understanding.  No offense...

Global warming - (rhetorical) if global warming is happening as you say, how do you explain a cooling (with the exception of 2006) over the past decade, and the subsequent Ice Age theory raising it's head again, when not only has carbon levels due to automobile use increased over the same period but the Arctic Climate Research Center of Illinois showed with satellite photo's that not only is Arctic ice back to 1979 levels, but is has INCREASED 5%?  Why have you not heard this in the media?  Don't just accept what you are spoon-fed by the media, who rarely do more than regurgitate what is spoon-fed them. 

Global "warming" AND "coolig" are cyclical.



Now, the above chart shows the "existing" thoughts on temperature fluctuation of which there are varying thoughts on the same and dissenting opinions.  I say "existing" because these "theories" fluctuate as much as temps do over time.

Just a thought...
Composition of the atmosphere, courtesy of Physical Geography eBook (Also found in many fine physical geography and geology print editions)

Nitrogen N2 78.08%
Oxygen O2 20.95%
*Water H2O 0 to 4%
Argon Ar 0.93%
*Carbon Dioxide CO2 0.0360%
Neon Ne 0.0018%
Helium He 0.0005%
*Methane CH4 0.00017%
Hydrogen H2 0.00005%
*Nitrous Oxide N2O 0.00003%
*Ozone O3 0.000004%

(Above atmoshphere levels were copied and pasted because I am too lazy to type it...)


Anyway. the world must indeed be ending, a "tree hugger" agrees that carbon credits are bogus and a fraud, and a "greedy capitalist" doesn't want to breath bad air and thinks recycling and alternative energy are good.... what's the world coming to!

« Last Edit: January 20, 2009, 12:58:30 pm by PositiveOutlook »

Offline jfpen

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Re: I hate to tell you I (and others) told you so, but...
« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2009, 03:50:19 pm »
sunnyskyinvestor - your regurgitation of mediaspeak - "phony war, OIL SPEC, GREED" just shows your lack of geopolitcal understanding.  No offense...

Global warming - (rhetorical) if global warming is happening as you say, how do you explain a cooling (with the exception of 2006) over the past decade, and the subsequent Ice Age theory raising it's head again, when not only has carbon levels due to automobile use increased over the same period but the Arctic Climate Research Center of Illinois showed with satellite photo's that not only is Arctic ice back to 1979 levels, but is has INCREASED 5%?  Why have you not heard this in the media?  Don't just accept what you are spoon-fed by the media, who rarely do more than regurgitate what is spoon-fed them. 

Global "warming" AND "coolig" are cyclical.



Now, the above chart shows the "existing" thoughts on temperature fluctuation of which there are varying thoughts on the same and dissenting opinions.  I say "existing" because these "theories" fluctuate as much as temps do over time.

Just a thought...
Composition of the atmosphere, courtesy of Physical Geography eBook (Also found in many fine physical geography and geology print editions)

Nitrogen N2 78.08%
Oxygen O2 20.95%
*Water H2O 0 to 4%
Argon Ar 0.93%
*Carbon Dioxide CO2 0.0360%
Neon Ne 0.0018%
Helium He 0.0005%
*Methane CH4 0.00017%
Hydrogen H2 0.00005%
*Nitrous Oxide N2O 0.00003%
*Ozone O3 0.000004%

(Above atmoshphere levels were copied and pasted because I am too lazy to type it...)


Anyway. the world must indeed be ending, a "tree hugger" agrees that carbon credits are bogus and a fraud, and a "greedy capitalist" doesn't want to breath bad air and thinks recycling and alternative energy are good.... what's the world coming to!



Positiveoutlook,
                    Because of what you state, the term "Global Warming" has been replaced with "Climate Change".

JP

 




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