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Author Topic: title company & tax sale properties  (Read 6742 times)

Offline rogerenriquez

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title company & tax sale properties
« on: January 07, 2004, 11:22:29 pm »
I reside in Bexar county (San Antonio) and I am having problems getting title insurance on properties that I purchased at tax and commissioner's sales.  In spite of waiting six months or even one year on non-homestead, non-agricultural property, title companies will not issue title insurance.  The homestudy courses say that a suit to "quiet title" will do the trick but when I ask course peddlers for additional information they do not reply.  This behavior leads me to believe that they have never done it themselves.  In virtually all tax sale cases, previous owners cannot be contacted (dead or moved away) and therefore quit claim deeds are not an option.  If you have encountered a solution to this problem please reply... I would like to continue this method of real estate investing but due to the title insurance complications, I may need to pursue another course of action.

Regards,
RE

Offline tedjr

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Re:title company & tax sale properties
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2004, 05:47:31 am »
I noticed you got no response to your post. Have you solved the problem and found a title company that will write a policy. I am curious too as I went to a tax sale earlier this month and wanted to bid on several deals. If you have not located one I will help you search too

Good luck and thank you,
Ted P. Stokely Jr
11505 Sw Oaks
Austin, Texas  78737
512-301-9171 home
512-587-6177 mobile

Ted P. Stokely Jr

San Antonio, Texas

Offline pshmo3

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Re:title company & tax sale properties
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2004, 09:34:02 pm »
I was just about to purchase one of the tax lien courses when I read your post. I was wondering if you would mind sharing some info with me, to be more specific:
1) Who course are you using?
2) Was it any good? Was it worth the money?
3) I am assuming by your post that the aithor has not responded to your emails, is this true?
4) This title insurance issue seems like a killer to me. Whats the status? What have you found out?
5) Hows life?

If you don't want to call out the author on the forum I can understand that, so feel free to send me an email. The address is below.

Look forward to hearing from you, and thanks.

Larry Johnson
[email protected]

Offline rogerenriquez

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Re:title company & tax sale properties
« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2004, 09:35:15 am »
Larry,

I'll take these in reverse order.

Life is good, thanks for asking. :D

The title insurance problem is a difficulty because it limits the options available to investors.  No, I have not found a title company that will insure faster than two years after the deed is recorded.  In the meantime, I rent the property out until the title company will insure.  Also, I am much more pro-active when doing research.  Many of these problems can be avoided if you know how to screen the properties.

I purchased the Darius Brazandeh course it is good.  I believe that it is a good value for $99.  It provides a lot of nuts and bolts information.  My only criticism is that the course is replete with statements like "email me or call me with problems."  I emailed him three times with a question about "suit to quiet title" and got no response.  Not a big deal but just want people to know that they will be flying solo after the sale.

I believe the single most important thing to keep in mind is that you must pay attention to detail when dealing with tax sale property.

Regards,
RE

Offline pshmo3

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Re:title company & tax sale properties
« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2004, 11:28:57 am »
Thanks for the info.

Larry Johnson
[email protected]

Offline DariusBarazandeh

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Re:title company & tax sale properties
« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2004, 05:49:20 pm »
Roger,

My apologies for any mix-up in our communication process.   I do take alot of time to get back to everyone who has questions.  I am sorry that your questions were not answered.  I have had a higher than normal number of emails coming from students and new investors over the last 6 months.  In some instances I found that some emails where getting sent back due to the volume (I presume). I have since cleared this up with my account provider and have not heard otherwise.

My course was actually one of the first to let people know about the title insurance issues which can face tax sale investors.  When I began investing in Texas tax sales, I read everyone's product and no one mentioned that the Suit to Quiet Title may be needed.  I learned from my own investments and real estate law practice that it should be done if your 'buyer' seeks traditional financing.  Title insurance is not legally required in order to have a complete real estate transaction, however if your purchaser intends to borrow money from a lending institution (i.e. a bank) it is needed.  The Suit to Quiet Title is used to help you attain title insurance. Keep in mind that the Suit to Quiet Title and/or title insurance is not absolutely needed if you want to utilize a: 1) lease option, 2) owner carried financing, or 3) landlord-tenant situation.

As an attorney I can tell you a few things about the Suit to Quiet Title process.  I will give you an overview, then if you have questions go ahead and email me again at [email protected]

The Suit to Quiet Title is brought because the title company wants to make sure that any heirs, claimants, or creditors will not make any claims against the property.  Their biggest fear is that the sheriff or constableís office has not properly carried out due process requirements. In such an event someone with an interest in the property might try to come back and say they were not notified, and then the title company would have to pay for the cost to clear up the dispute.  The title company believes that if 2 to 3 years pass (after redemption) and no one brings up a claim, then it is likely no one ever will.  As a result it is less risky for them to issue an insurance policy on the property.   Obtaining title insurance is an area that may result in some difficulty during the first 2 to 3 years of property ownership. The usual challenge will be brought by someone who has lost their interest due to the foreclosure.  Letís think about who stands to lose when the tax defaulted property is foreclosed. The typical parties who will try to raise a challenge are typically:

-the delinquent property owner;
-an heir (someone who may have an inheritance right under a will or state  intestacy inheritance scheme);
-someone who holds a court judgment which had attached to the property; and/or;
-a creditor

All of these parties may argue that foreclosure proceeding itself was not legal.  The most common area of attack deals with notice.  The most common attack on a tax deed typically comes from a creditor or the delinquent property owner who claims they were not properly notified.  For example, they may argue that the notice itself was ineffective and never reached them.  Another area of attack is the property description.  If the description of the property was not exact then it can be argued that they were not really put on notice.  

From the outset let me be very clear: The quiet title lawsuit is a formal court proceeding.  Before you begin to cringe again about having to hire an attorney once again recall that you are in a very favorable financial position at this point.  First, recall that since redemption has not occured then you stand to make a good deal of profit on the deal. Remember if your research has been accurate, the value you receive from the real estate should far exceed any of your costs.

At this point letís assume you have hired an attorney:   I want to walk you through the steps that he/she will take to execute the quiet title lawsuit for you.  The attorney will first file a lawsuit in the county where the property is located.  The attorney must then perform adequate and careful research to determine who held a potential claim on the property.  This could include the same parties discussed above:

-the delinquent property owner;
-an heir (someone who may have an inheritance right under a will or state  intestacy inheritance scheme);
-someone who holds a court judgment which had attached to the property; and/or;
-a creditor

The quiet title lawsuit allows you prove the validity of your title to the rest of the world. The successful quiet title action will provide more certainty to potential purchasers and insurers of the property.  In the world of real estate financing you typically will be dealing with commercial lenders such as banks.  Banks will typically not issue a loan on a property without title insurance.  Title insurance companies are usually not willing to issue a title policy, unless they can make sure that any heirs, claimants, or creditors will not make any claims against the property.

Remember: The Suit to Quiet Title is not needed if you simply want to rent out the property, sell it via a lease option or carry the note for your buyer.   It is typically only needed when the seller seeks traditional financing.  The cost of the suit can range from $800 to $1200 dollars.  Not a bad deal if you make alot of money on the deal.  

If anyone has any questions please send me an email.  Once again I apologize for any mix-up.  

Darius M. Barazandeh, Attorney at Law
« Last Edit: March 24, 2004, 12:01:46 am by TRandle »
Warmest Regards,
Darius M. Barazandeh, JD/MBA
www.theinformedinvestor.com

Offline DariusBarazandeh

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Re:title company & tax sale properties
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2004, 12:22:08 am »
Roger,

I have a copy of an original petition for the Land Title Suit.  I'll send you link tomarrow.
Warmest Regards,
Darius M. Barazandeh, JD/MBA
www.theinformedinvestor.com

Offline rogerenriquez

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Re:title company & tax sale properties
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2004, 10:53:00 am »
To the Board:

Over the past few weeks I have been comunicating via email with Darius and he has provided a wealth of information on Suit to Quiet Title.  Seriously, the depth and breadth of information I received is astounding.  I had my doubts (see previous posts) however, Darius has made a true believer out of me.  I have always said that his homestudy course is a good value for the money.  However, I must now retract my earlier statement and state that his course along with the mentoring he provides is priceless.  Any potential tax sale investor MUST have his course in their library, and his email in their address book.

Thank you.
Roger

Offline pshmo3

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Re:title company & tax sale properties
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2004, 09:57:34 am »
I puchased and read the course. I have not yet done anything with the information, except some initial research.

First off I think this is one of the best written, most straight forward courses I have purchased, and I really like the section that lays out the possible pitfalls and what you need to do to avoid them. I agree with Darius' statement that these are skipped in most courses and only come up when you actually try to apply the knowledge they are selling.

Second, the inabilty to obtain title insurance does not seem like such a big issue to me. It would obviously be an issue if you were trying to flip for cash, I can see that, but it doesn't seem like this is meant to be a quick cash business. He does offer some sound ways around it like owner financing, but I personally like the concept of just renting the thing out for cash flow. If you wanted to sell it two - three years later, at least according to the text, you would be able to obtain title insurance at that time.

Anyway, I just thought I would let everyone know what I thought about the course since I had asked Roger about it earlier.

Larry Johnson
[email protected]

Offline DariusBarazandeh

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Re:title company & tax sale properties
« Reply #9 on: March 27, 2004, 11:56:29 am »
Generally if you wait about 2 years after the redemption period has passed then you should have no trouble getting title insurance.  I am seen it in my own investing and it has been confirmed many times by purchasers of the course.

So whats the general theme here?  You need to be somewhat patient.

Travis county seems to be hot right now...
Warmest Regards,
Darius M. Barazandeh, JD/MBA
www.theinformedinvestor.com

 




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