We apologize, but the forums are closed for new posts. Click Here To Join The Unemployables Facebook Group

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
December 06, 2021, 11:42:14 am
Home Help Search Calendar Login Register

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
December 06, 2021, 11:42:14 am
Home Help Search Calendar Login Register

Author Topic: Can you make a living from bird dogging?  (Read 17646 times)

Offline salemgurl

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #15 on: February 04, 2006, 08:21:31 pm »
John, :)

Can you help answer any of the questions posted from me and the other newbies?
Are your students willing to assist us here in this forum?
 ???
thank you

Offline $Cash$

  • Moderator
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1253
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #16 on: February 04, 2006, 08:36:26 pm »
salemgurl,

Nothing would please me more or to have my students post here to help. I will not identify who they are, but there are quite a few that do post here at the REIClub.

I would like to do referrals, however it would be against board policy.

I will pay a little more attention to this forum and answer anyone's question to help them get started in our great industry.

So fire away with any questions or problems anyone needs assistance with.

John $Cash$ Locke
"If people like you they'll listen to you, but if they trust you they'll do business with you."
"Training gives knowledge, knowledge gives confidence and confidence gives victory."

Offline salemgurl

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #17 on: February 05, 2006, 09:58:15 am »
Hi!

I don’t think any of us would ever ask for private/personal information.

Here are some of the questions posed on the board.  Here are just the latest ones (anyone who knows SUCCESSFUL answers please respond)

Robertlaf asked in a previous post:
Are there websites which you can look up addresses and get info?

This is helpful info. I just started bird dogging, locating the properties that are vacant is about all I do now but hope to increase that. I can't wholesale yet. I put out 1000;s of circulars a week so I spot them all the time.
Are there websites which you can look up addresses and get info?

I have 2 investors who want to work with me. One said he would sign a contract which I don't care too much about. If he wants to cheat me he won't get any more business from me and how would I know anyyway? Maybe I should sign one with him, I don't know.

I am giving each half my properties, not the same ones and see who makes deals and pays me.
One of my investors has a bus driver who is offering him vacant houses with a worksheet with info about the house and pictures on each one in Dallas. The birddog wants $10 a house. It looks like a good deal to me if I was an investor but my investor says he doesn't have the money.
So any tips for me would be appreciated Thanks.

And my questions are:
#1.  How should one approach investors?
#2.  What standard contract form can and should we "bird dogs" use and is it
      available through http://www.microsoft.com (they have 100's of
      basic contracts that can be edited)
#3.  Many cities have "Registry of Deeds" websites (ex: www.citydeeds.com)
#4.  Investors want to know and what to bring to the investor....
        a. the "location"....I don't give out the address just the general area
        b. if the building is vacant or lived in and for sale by owner or realtor
        c. cost of rehab  (i use the Robyn Thompson method www.robynthompson.com)
        d. ARV - After Repair Value  
        e. Comps (to figure out the AVERAGE price the property will sell for ARV)
#5.  Many people have asked what to charge and it has basically been given in a few
        responses from 10%, 10% for information/10% after sell and $500 - $1000.
#6.  Pricing depends on the individuals involved but what else?

I need to learn more terms (I've read them and forgot the majority of them). So, my suggestion is for the seasoned investors to start using the terms "investors" use so us "NEWBIES" get comfortable and familiar with the correct terminology! ~

and the subject that started this forum:
Anyone here making a good living just bird dogging?

We haven’t heard from anyone who has personally made a good living aka a successful living “JUST” bird dogging?

So, we are still waiting for those who have had the financial success !

Thank you all!!!

Offline $Cash$

  • Moderator
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1253
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #18 on: February 05, 2006, 10:53:02 am »
Let's start with these questions:

Robertlaf asked in a previous post:

Q.  Are there websites which you can look up addresses and get info?

This is helpful info. I just started bird dogging, locating the properties that are vacant is about all I do now but hope to increase that. I can't wholesale yet. I put out 1000;s of circulars a week so I spot them all the time.  Are there websites which you can look up addresses and get info?

A.  Yes, there are sites that will give you all the information you need, comps, mortgage amount, name of owners, etc.  I use
www.sitexdata.com this is not free information, however as in any business you need to work up a budget within your spending limits, to be effective you will need to spend money if you want to become successful.

Q.  I have 2 investors who want to work with me. One said he would sign a contract which I don't care too much about. If he wants to cheat me he won't get any more business from me and how would I know anyyway? Maybe I should sign one with him, I don't know.

A.  Trust is very important in our industry, but remember you are running a business and the hand shake days are long gone, get it in writing so everyone is on the same page.

Q.  I am giving each half my properties, not the same ones and see who makes deals and pays me.  One of my investors has a bus driver who is offering him vacant houses with a worksheet with info about the house and pictures on each one in Dallas. The birddog wants $10 a house. It looks like a good deal to me if I was an investor but my investor says he doesn't have the money.  So any tips for me would be appreciated Thanks.

A.  Get an agreement signed between you and the investor before turning over any leads!  If an investor does not have $10 bucks for a picture do not call him an investor, because he is not.   There are many wannabe's out there who call themselves investor's, so I will relate a true story.

One of my students regularly attended his local investors club.  When he first started attending these meetings he was in awe of some of the investors there talking about real estate investing and their deals.  After a few months he started doing Subject To deals, then at one meeting rather shyly he said to these same investors, just completed my 5th Subject To deal, then it became quite and these same investors started grilling him about how are you doing it, where did you find these deals, etc.  It was his last investors club meeting.

Moral of the story do not look at anyone as an investor becasue they only talk the talk.   Until an investor can prove to you they have really done deals, do not feel intiminated by asking them prove it.   This will also make you look like a professional in what you do and you don't have the time to mess with broke wannabe's.

John $Cash$ Locke
« Last Edit: February 05, 2006, 11:20:50 am by $Cash$ »
"If people like you they'll listen to you, but if they trust you they'll do business with you."
"Training gives knowledge, knowledge gives confidence and confidence gives victory."

Offline $Cash$

  • Moderator
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1253
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #19 on: February 05, 2006, 11:14:35 am »
salemgurl,

I will get to your questions later, let me first state that the title of this thread is not the way I would have asked the question and here is why.

"Anyone here making a good living just bird dogging?"  or as a - realtor - investor - mortgage broker - re habber, etc.  Anyone could have just said "yes" and went on to another thread and what would you have really learned or known if they were telling the truth?

The question I would have asked is "How can I become successful as a Bird Dog?' now this would have cut to the chase.  By looking at the replies, you would soon find out whether the poster is cutting and pasting out of a course or have actually had expierence in their field of endevor or from an investor who is working with Bird Dogs in their investing career.

John $Cash$ Locke
« Last Edit: February 05, 2006, 01:08:33 pm by $Cash$ »
"If people like you they'll listen to you, but if they trust you they'll do business with you."
"Training gives knowledge, knowledge gives confidence and confidence gives victory."

Offline salemgurl

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #20 on: February 05, 2006, 05:09:30 pm »
Okay, I'm going to ignore some of the last comments made on this particular forum because it seems no one's questions will be answered.  They are being ignored.

Why is this?

Isn't this board for newbies to have questions answered without having statements......

I hope some of our questions get replied to.

Offline Roger J

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1476
    • Hickory NC Homes For Sales
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #21 on: February 05, 2006, 08:12:06 pm »
Okay, I'm going to ignore some of the last comments made on this particular forum because it seems no one's questions will be answered.  They are being ignored.

GEEZ, Salem what do you want, a straight brain transplant to your head from ours?
Wonderful idea, btw.  You're going to ignore some of the last comments (some VERY good replies by Cash, if I do say so) BECAUSE you if you're being ignored.  Let me know how that works out!

Isn't this board for newbies to have questions answered without having statements......
No it isn't.  I think Cash said it plainly enough.  If this post's question was answered without "statements" then it would be a yes or no answer.  Hard to learn that way.

I hope some of our questions get replied to.
If you'll reread some of the above posts, I think that you'll find that most have been answered VERY thoroughly.  In fact, here's a reply to the original post: "In answer to the original question:  It would be VERY difficult to make a living as a REI birddog unless you live in a large market area with alot of active investors that you can network with.  Also, if you were good enough as a birddog to actually make a living doing it, then you would probably have (or should have) moved on to wholesaling/investing yourself.

The primary reason a person becomes a birddog is so that they can learn the business from a successful investor."  Pulled from my first post, btw.

Now, to your questions:
And my questions are:
#1.  How should one approach investors?
From behind, much easier to sneak up on them that way!  Or you could try advertising in the newspaper, or visiting where they tend to hang out (a REIA for example) and give them your card and say something like, "Hi, I'm Salemgurl and if you're interested, I'd like to do some birddogging for you."
#2.  What standard contract form can and should we "bird dogs" use and is it
      available through http://www.microsoft.com (they have 100's of
      basic contracts that can be edited)
Didn't know that microsoft had 100's of contracts on their site (and don't know why they would).  See, if I'd just ignored you, I wouldn't have learned something today.  What you're looking for in a 'basic' contract is an independent contractor contact.
#3.  Many cities have "Registry of Deeds" websites (ex: www.citydeeds.com)  Yes, they do.
#4.  Investors want to know and what to bring to the investor....
        a. the "location"....I don't give out the address just the general area
 That works, but the investor will need to know the actual address if they plan on buying
       b. if the building is vacant or lived in and for sale by owner or realtor   The investor needs to know WHO to contact to make a deal
       c. cost of rehab  (i use the Robyn Thompson method www.robynthompson.com)  Not a birddog's job. You shouldn't even be in the place to get an estimate of repair before the investor
       d. ARV - After Repair Value  A general idea, yes, but again it's the investors job to determine IF there is a deal.  A birddog 'points' out potential deals.
       e. Comps (to figure out the AVERAGE price the property will sell for ARV)  Nope.  Investors job
#5.  Many people have asked what to charge and it has basically been given in a few
        responses from 10%, 10% for information/10% after sell and $500 - $1000.
 Price a birddog gets varies from market to market and also from the experience of the birddog and the potential of the deal.  Here for example, the basic fee is $250, but I pay more to my birddogs that provide me with consistent quality leads.  I also pay the good ones for leads whether I close or not because I want to make sure that I am the investor that gets their leads.
#6.  Pricing depends on the individuals involved but what else? See above

Raj

www.HickoryNCHomes.com Search for all Hickory NC Homes for Sale.

Offline $Cash$

  • Moderator
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1253
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #22 on: February 05, 2006, 08:41:12 pm »
Raj,

Agreed, that post made me think of the kid in the back seat saying "are we there yet?", rather than saying "how are we going to get there and how long will it take?"

Are we there yet?  NO!

How are we going to get there and how long will it take?  This would take making some comments so the person asking would have the answers and understand why.

Guess who is not going to help someone who only wants to know "are we there yet?"

Good job Raj, more patience than I,

John $Cash$ Locke
"If people like you they'll listen to you, but if they trust you they'll do business with you."
"Training gives knowledge, knowledge gives confidence and confidence gives victory."

Offline salemgurl

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #23 on: February 06, 2006, 12:28:47 pm »
Raj and John,

Thank you for responding to the questions posted but if you look back there was too much chit chatting. ;)
I'm not trying to start crap, It would be nice to have some informative answers though, I do agree, Yes and No answers are just wayyyyy too vague.  

But the "TOPIC" message still hasn't been answered fully (the second part of the question) from successful bird dogs....the topic went from .....
1. "Depends on how much money you want to earn.." (stated by "yrush")
2. to convincing why a person shouldn't bird dog but instead wholesale
3. to everything in between.....

I truly wanted to hear a
"SUCCESS STORY FROM AN ACTUAL BIRD DOG"[/i][/u]

I presume Raj and John both are seasoned investors,  well, I know that John is and sells a bird dogging program.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This one post was good but also confusing (the later half)

Roger J stated:
"...As a birddog, your only job is to find "potential" deals for an investor.  It's the investors job to close them.  
Simply saying, "there's an abandoned house on xyz street, the owner's name is xxx and here's their number" is what a birddog does.  
Or "I got a lead that xxx is interested in selling their property and needs to move it fast."  That's what a birddog does.  
They do NOT call sellers.  
They do NOT negotiate terms.  
They do NOT do anything more than point out the leads for the investor.  
They also do NOT have any liability issues because they are only supplying information.
 No negotiating, and no contracts to sell/assign.  
They also have no money invested in deals and no risk if they don't close.

As far as getting a contract when birddogging, you can if you want, but why bother?
If you're only going to be netting around $250-500 per deal, it's hardly worth a contract. "

--------------------------------------
okay that said (and I really am a sweet person) 8)

I've personally answered several ads from "We buy homes" ads...and the investors want to know (perhaps this is just in massachusetts):

a. cost of the home (before repairs) aka if the home is on the market what is the price
b. how much work needs to be done to it (they generally ask for a figure)
c. and the After Repair Value
d. who to contact (home owner or realtor)....I had one who wanted me to send the homeowner a letter and have them contact me (this investor found a foreclosed property in my state)....

John stated:

Get an agreement signed between you and the investor before turning over any leads!
-----------------------------------------------
Other questions:
So, are these the correct steps to take?:

*before hand I can contact investors and ask them "what type of deal is right for you"?

1.  "locate" the property(ies)
2.  meet with the  investor (face to face) or if via phone (fax to fax or email to email)
3.  sign the independent contract   (duties, price to be paid)    
4.  and give the investor the address of the property

Rip offs are what we all want to "avoid".  
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Raj, you noted:
        a.  the investor will need to know the actual address if they plan on buying
        b. The investor needs to know WHO to contact to make a deal
        c. cost of rehab is Not a birddog's job. You shouldn't even be in the place to get an estimate of repair before the investor
        d. ARV - After Repair Value  A general idea, yes, but again it's the investors job to determine IF there is a deal.  A birddog 'points' out potential deals.
        e. Comps are not the bird dogs job but the  Investors job

**I was under the impression that the birddogs job was to make it "easier" for the investor and do the basic legwork**
------------------------------------------------------------
My research work leads (I found these on Microsoft Templates)
Contracts
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/results.aspx?Scope=TC&Query=contracts

Independent contractor employment agreement
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/templates/TC062563061033.aspx
« Last Edit: February 06, 2006, 01:15:00 pm by salemgurl »

Offline Roger J

  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1476
    • Hickory NC Homes For Sales
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #24 on: February 06, 2006, 01:56:37 pm »
salemgurl,

Okay, it seems that we 'chit-chat' too much for you and answer too little.  What you want is details! details! details!
So, let me ask you a question, have you purchased a book/course on birddogging yet?  There are a few out there now (some call it 'jobbing') on birddogging, and as you stated, John has one as well.

If you're wanting 'just the facts' then I personally know that John's book covers 99% of what you're asking here and seem dissatisfied with the answers.

If you're looking to be a success in this business, I hope that you're willing to spend a little $$$ to learn it.

And I believe that original question has been answered and quite well, I might add.  I gave a very detailed answer.  It seemed to satisfy parei78 has he hasn't responded back.  But if you want it simple and clean then, NO, I don't believe that you can 'make a living' as a birddog, and I don't think that you should try.

The focus of a birddog is to learn the business with little risk.  As I've already stated, IF you can be successful as a birddog, then you should have moved on.  For example, I started out birddogging (and in fact, still do it for the deals that I don't/can't do), and have now moved on to currently owning 3 real estate related businesses.  I'd like to think that that is at least a little successful.

You'll have to be more specific on what was confusing in my post in order to clarify.

As to contracts or not, I never worried about them BECAUSE a) what I was getting paid wasn't worth the bother b) The major reason that I was birddogging was to learn the process of REI and c) I'm just a country hick and still believe in the handshake and a person's word.  More specifically, I believe that by NOT having a contract, I could better determine WHO I wanted to be in business, and WHO I did not.

As to what a birddog does:  I believe that I've been pretty clear as to what I THINK a birddog's job is and isn't.  If you've given a good quality lead to an investor, then you HAVE done most of the legwork, as finding the deal is the hardest part.

Example:  I call John up and say, 'John, I just got a call from Salemgurl.  She needs to sell her house fast.  She owes $80k, She thinks that the FMV is $100K.  The property was built in 2000 and she says it doesn't need any work.  She said that all she wants is payoff for it and she'll be happy.  Would you like for me to set up an appointment for you to meet with her?'

As to your "we buy houses" guys.  They're either lazy or new with my bet being on new.  They've read some book that told them to stick up a sign and ask these questions.

Raj
www.HickoryNCHomes.com Search for all Hickory NC Homes for Sale.

Offline salemgurl

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #25 on: February 06, 2006, 02:15:34 pm »
Roger/Raj,

AWESOME!!!!

You did very well....
---------------------------------------------------
'just the facts.......' (that's what we want...factual answers)But if you want it simple and clean then,

NO, I don't believe that you can 'make a living' as a birddog, and I don't think that you should try.

The focus of a birddog is to learn the business with little risk.  

IF you can be successful as a birddog, then you should .... try the next step which would either be wholesales or investing

For example, I started out birddogging (and in fact, still do it for the deals that I don't/can't do), and have now moved on to currently owning 3 real estate related businesses.  I'd like to think that that is at least a little successful.     I'd call that very successful, i'm glad one of you finally let us know that you were sucessful at bird dogging in order to move on to the next step....I know I appreciate hearing from those who have actually made it work
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As to contracts or not, I never worried about them BECAUSE
a) what I was getting paid wasn't worth the bother
b) The major reason that I was birddogging was to learn the process of REI and
c) I'm just a country hick and still believe in the handshake and a person's word.  
More specifically, I believe that by NOT having a contract, I could better determine WHO I wanted to be in business, and WHO I did not.

I like what you stated in ( c ) you have explained why you did not do the contract while giving us an understanding which can be related to!!!!  not just an off the wall, quickie
--------------------------------------------------------------------
As to what a birddog does:  If you've given a good quality lead to an investor, then you HAVE done most of the legwork, as finding the deal is the hardest part.

Example:  I call John up and say, 'John, I just got a call from Salemgurl.  She needs to sell her house fast.  She owes $80k, She thinks that the FMV is $100K.  The property was built in 2000 and she says it doesn't need any work.  She said that all she wants is payoff for it and she'll be happy.  Would you like for me to set up an appointment for you to meet with her?'
-------------------------------------------------
As to your "we buy houses" guys.  They're either lazy or new with my bet being on new.  They've read some book that told them to stick up a sign and ask these questions.
-------------------------------------------------
 This is the simplicity to the main question and also gives us more information from a sucessful birddog!  and I thank you for this firm and honest simplification of bird dogging success!!! and without much chit chat!!

Way to go!!!!  that's how to do it!!
-------------------------------------------------------------
If you're looking to be a success in this business, I hope that you're willing to spend a little $$$ to learn it, purchased a book/course on birddogging.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Now, I feel much more comfortable purchasing a book knowing that this can be done.

Offline robertlaf

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 8
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #26 on: February 06, 2006, 05:48:26 pm »
To everybody that answered thanks. To Cash Locke, I know you from another board and I know the time you spend helping people  when you don't really have to. Thanks for your help. it is changing my viewpoint on this one guy.

Could anyone give a very general process of what it takes to get a  seller under contract the way whoesalers do  ?. Why would a seller sign a contract to just you and give you exclusive rights to buy his house? Why is that in his best interests assuming it would  be for him to sign a contract to you?
I assume it's in the art of negoitating a deal and you tell him you have investors lined up and will get him the best rice or something to that effect.

Offline b18bgone

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 82
    • www.insaneleads.com
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #27 on: February 07, 2006, 07:34:30 pm »


I truly wanted to hear a[/color] "SUCCESS STORY FROM AN ACTUAL BIRD DOG"[/i][/u]

Well I have been doing this sence I finished my internship in college last May, well thats when I opened a company to strickly find properties.........I have one company that I invest all of my leads to, and they treat me very well.  It took me a while to get it just right, I never read a single book about bird dogging, but I did, and still do have a mentor.  People over look mentoring, and all most see in this game is the MONEY, its more than that to me.  In the past 7months, working part time, my company made about 84K, some of which wasnt collected until 06, because of tax reasons.  I can honestly say I live in the nice middle class home I live in because of bird dogging.  As a company there is a goal of 10 properties a month.  Thats the quotta, and the funny thing is, is that almost all of that 84K is PROFIT (after following some of the CPAs stratagies).  The company is expanding and I teach newbies tricks, and they are well compensated, I want to totally dominate my market...... Dont know if that counts for a success story, but Im happy, I have actaully been able to invest some of my funds on deals now, I think that is really cool.  

Offline rikfoote

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #28 on: February 07, 2006, 09:03:57 pm »
Yes, you can make a living doing this however I recomend that you use it as a stepping stone rather than a long term investing strategy.

Bird Dogging or Scouting is a great way to get started as a real estate investor.  

Offline salemgurl

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re:Can you make a living from bird dogging?
« Reply #29 on: February 08, 2006, 07:33:15 am »
It is really nice to see when success stories are posted!

Yes, this is a stepping stone.......in order for us to gain experience and then go onto

Investing   OR   the wholesales

ONLY A STEPPING STONE....yes we've got that!

Any other success stories???
and the steps you took to become successful?
We are all looking for mentors and this info is awesome!

thank you!

 




SMF 2.0.15 | SMF © 2017, Simple Machines