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Miscellaneous => Random Ramblings => Topic started by: rookieNYC on March 26, 2009, 03:38:53 pm

Title: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: rookieNYC on March 26, 2009, 03:38:53 pm
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/politics/obama/chi-rahm-emanuel-profit-26-mar26,0,5682373.story

Its ok for Rahm Emanuel to clean out Freddie Mac for $320,000 while the world crumbles but God forbid any Republicans made 10 cents...

Bluemoon let me guess,Bush made him do it right?
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: John_in_NC on March 26, 2009, 08:53:59 pm
I think he summed up the whole Obama administration strategy in this one interview.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mzcbXi1Tkk
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: JakeRodgers on March 26, 2009, 10:01:00 pm
Don't you get it? When you live in Lefty Land, you don't actually have to DO anything ("...who made at least $320,000 for a 14-month stint at Freddie Mac that required little effort.") to get rewarded and promoted. Same thing with Geithner- you don't pay your taxes, you get a political nomination. It's so ingenious, why didn't I think of not paying my taxes earlier!! COME ON....!!
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: sellnbama on March 27, 2009, 10:13:53 am
This administration is a group of artist who differ our concerns,then ramble on their own agenda.People are starting to see that obama is not a president as much as a dictator(aka czar,the word he loves so much).He stutters and stumbles without a teleprompter telling him what david axelrod wrote for him to recite.Wise up people!Visit and join the912project.com This is not a democrate/republican problem its an honesty problem.The economy has been falling since 07 ,So why was it our new presidents first order of business to announce closing of gitmo?This was during the 1st 2 weeks!How does that effect economy.Its time to ask yourself "whats this guys real agenda? 
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: furnishedowner on March 30, 2009, 10:10:58 pm
When did REICLUB develop into the BASH LIBERALS site?

Come on guys, people who invest in real estate vote in in many flavors.
It's a waste of time to just bash each other. There must be political websites out there for that.

How we vote is based on our ethnicity and personal history as much as where we are today.

I have voted Republican in the past--Nixon! AARghhh...but I keep going back to how my immigrant father figured out how to vote when he was first naturalized and became eligible.  He asked another immigrant farmer, "How do you know who to vote for?"

"It's easy," was the reply. "Republicans is the party for the rich people. Democrats are the party for the poor people."

That settled it for Dad. "I'm a Democrat for sure then!"

It's great to debate issues. But I am bothered when it degenerates into the kind of toxic hate-bashing espoused by people like Rush Limbaugh.

That's not the kind of American I want to be. We are all together in this, and we can solve our problems by debate, not hate.

Furnishedowner, a liberal-leaning lefty, at least for now.

Furnishedowner
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Vader on March 30, 2009, 11:36:31 pm
When did REICLUB develop into the BASH LIBERALS site?

Come on guys, people who invest in real estate vote in in many flavors.
It's a waste of time to just bash each other. There must be political websites out there for that.

How we vote is based on our ethnicity and personal history as much as where we are today.

I have voted Republican in the past--Nixon! AARghhh...but I keep going back to how my immigrant father figured out how to vote when he was first naturalized and became eligible.  He asked another immigrant farmer, "How do you know who to vote for?"

"It's easy," was the reply. "Republicans is the party for the rich people. Democrats are the party for the poor people."

That settled it for Dad. "I'm a Democrat for sure then!"

It's great to debate issues. But I am bothered when it degenerates into the kind of toxic hate-bashing espoused by people like Rush Limbaugh.

That's not the kind of American I want to be. We are all together in this, and we can solve our problems by debate, not hate.

Furnishedowner, a liberal-leaning lefty, at least for now.

Furnishedowner

Well said, its one of the reasons I barely come to this site anymore. Pretty much bashing the current administration non-stop, when the previous administration created much of the problems we face. I'm not pro any political party, I'm neutral, but it a shame there can't be healthy debate without all the bashing.

I'm glad fdjake is still around, he's one of the few who still posts very interesting stuff. We need more posters who post from a different angle to bring back life to the site. "If you build it....they will come" [back to this website].
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on March 31, 2009, 12:00:03 am
Furnishedowner,

What is sad to me is that "that was it" for your dad... had he actually looked a little deeper, he would have found that Democrats are not for the poor, but are only interested in how they can control them... any dispassionate reading of history reflects this... I have voted for Rep's, Dem's and Ind's over the years, but I can tell you that I don't make it a habit of voting for the one that believes government can do it better than it's people...

My mother was also from another country, and she didn't some to America at 21-22 years old to have the government do it for her...  Being one of thirteen kids growing up, she knew the value of hard work.  You either got up at 5am to pick potatoes before school, or you didn't eat.  When my father died, she worked two jobs raising many kids refusing government assistance.  She was an amazing women who ingrained the work ethic into her family, not one of dependance, ... once that is ingrained, it is EXTREMELY hard to get out from under it, although in America, you stand a better chance than in most places in the world.  She believed that if you fall, you get up and try again...

Immigrants don't brave the rough seas, or any of the many other ways they get here in the hopes of getting on the government dole... they do it for the OPPORTUNITY to live under a system of Life, Liberty and the PURSUIT of Happiness...  If we could just get the citizenry focused back on their Heritage, instead of sucking off the government nipple or leaching off of others labor wherever they can (with the latest being nationalized healthcare) imagine the potential that could be unlocked.  You will never get the best out of your child by doing it FOR them, but rather letting them do for THEMSELVES... we should not expect LESS from adults...

"BASH LIBERALS site" - well, I guess if you are being asked to defend your assertions and it's hard to do so, I guess you could fall back on that... it's intellectually weak, and you could always "change the channel", as it were, but I would think that conservatives, moderates, libertarians, etc. could all make the same argument.

"But I am bothered when it degenerates into the kind of toxic hate-bashing espoused by people like Rush Limbaugh."- Honestly, it like you are reading from a liberal website, and not thinking for yourself... I don't agree with Limbaugh on everything and if you don't understand his shtick, it's hard to "get" him, but I think you'll be better informed if you read all sides of an argument...  If you did, you'll find that Limbaugh is for the people, of ALL classes, not the government... 

With few exceptions... most "war zones" alot of REI's go into did not get into that condition by people who are hard working people and living "by the rules", but are rather those on government assistance, using or pushing drugs, no self-motivation, because they get a check from the government...  I'm sure alot of people here who rent to Section 8 tenants, and other's can testify to this fact. 

The more and more government involvement, the WORSE it gets... 

My question to you is when does this dependance on government stop?  At what point should the individual take responsibility for THEIR life, liberty and THEIR pursuit of happiness?...

Simply put, there is NOTHING  the government can do for you that you cannot do for yourself better... 

If you don't believe this, give control of your rental business over to the government and see how well they do representing YOUR interests...  yeah, I wouldn't either...

It's hard to defend what you believe sometimes, and even harder when you have to look at your own hypocrisy (as we all have done) and dig back in to work for what you believe in... We all fall, we just need to exhort more people to get back up themselves, instead of lying there WAITING for SOMEONE ELSE to do it for them... If not, you just enslave them to what SOMEONE ELSE thinks their life should be...
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on March 31, 2009, 12:14:37 am
Vader,

"We need more posters who post from a different angle to bring back life to the site." - Thank you for making my point entirely!  You mean more posters who agree with your "angle", right?  Otherwise, you wouldn't care about other people's "angle", and just read them for what they are, an opposing view to yours... Then, when it's "weighted" towards your "angle" then others of the opposing view can make the same argument, right?

"If you build it....they will come" - the argument can be made that is already the case... you just don't like that they don't match your "angle"...

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: rookieNYC on March 31, 2009, 06:36:29 am
This site has hardly become a liberal bashing site...Bush bashing and Republican bashing has been the norm for the past 8 years so get use to it taking a turn for a while...I have friends that voted for BO and are appalled at what he has implemented..He fooled many of his own people with his "change you can believe in " crap...He is no different than any politician but worse..He and his administration want to raise taxes on everyone and everything but they refuse to pay taxes themselves..He is closing gitmo and releasing these terrorists back into the streets..I could go on and on...Now you have Bidens kid snorting coke on tape,typical liberal activity...freedom yeah !!!!!...Socialism at its best...

What puzzles me is if  many of you are here to enrich yourselves with the RE investing thing why would you be for a socialist like BO?...So I assume you believe in affirmitive action across every aspect of your life...?....Sorry I disagree with everything this guy stands for..His administration and staff is a joke...I'm not saying McCain/Palin was the right ticket either but I would bet BO is a one term President..
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: propertymanager on March 31, 2009, 07:49:49 am
Quote
When did REICLUB develop into the BASH LIBERALS site?

REIClub is not a bash liberals site - that's just silly.  This particular section of REIClub, Random Ramblings, is a section designed to allow people to discuss non-rei related subjects.  Of course, politics is one of those subjects and I recall quite a bit of Republican "bashing" to go along with the Liberal "bashing". 

Why should anyone complain about what's posted?  If you don't like a particular topic or the comments of a particular poster, you can stop reading and not respond.

Back to the topic at hand:

Quote
but I keep going back to how my immigrant father figured out how to vote when he was first naturalized and became eligible.  He asked another immigrant farmer, "How do you know who to vote for?"

"It's easy," was the reply. "Republicans is the party for the rich people. Democrats are the party for the poor people."

That settled it for Dad. "I'm a Democrat for sure then!"

If your goal is to be poor and live on government handouts, then you have a very good reason to vote for Democrats (now socialists).  On the other hand, if your goal is to get out of poverty and make something of yourself, then the socialists are the enemy.  They stifle competition; punish success; and want to take YOUR MONEY and redistribute it as they see fit.

Conservatives (not to be confused with Republicans) are for freedom and individual rights.  You have the right to TRY to succeed and to PURSUE happiness.  You also have the right to fail.  I have the right to work hard and keep MY MONEY and I have no responsibility to pay for those that are too lazy to work.  I also have no responsibility to provide medical coverage for anyone that is too lazy to work.

If conservatism was boiled down to one idea - it would be PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY.  You and I are responsible for our decisions and our actions.

Mike
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: furnishedowner on March 31, 2009, 07:57:03 pm
Vader was right. More viewpoints are needed--balanced, logical, questioning.

I am a Capitalist. So are most entrepreneurial people. So why is it that if I don't deem myself a conservative Republican, then I am called a Socialist, a lefty, a welfare-loving fan of the government dole?

I am none of those things. But I am a Capitalist, and a registered Democrat. It is just nonsense to say that because I am a Democrat I am in favor of EVERYTHING that the Democratic administration espouses.

I voted. for the smartest candidate with the best platform. I feel Obama  is doing a Hell of a good job in an incredibly difficult time. I am willing to give him time to right the ship.

Positive Outlook: Sorry, but it is absurd to say that there is NOTHING the government can do for you that you can't do better yourself!
Like I can regulate the banks and financial institutions. Heck, I couldn't even control the interest on my own 'lil credit card! There are all kinds of things the government can do better.

What if we had just waited on our benevolent citizenry in the South to let African-Americans share in the schools, jobs, hotel rooms, lunch counter seats? It took the government to enforce Civil Rights.

As much as I would like to go after Al Queda and shut down their terrorist camps, I just can't do it. Nor can you.

I can't build bridges or highways. I can't take the National Census. I  like to travel, but I just can't negotiate with foreign leaders.

I am a Capitalist. I dislike extremism, whether it is right or left. It scares me.

I am very scared especially of religious fanaticism mixed with politics. When I choose someone to vote for, I lean towards the guy who does NOT start his resume with "Member of such-and-such church".  The person who can think and work things through rather than spout dogma. When I listen to (mostly) right-leaning religious politicians I can't help thinking of Hitler's stance: "Gott Mit Uns!"  That's way too close to the God-righteous religious fanaticism of the 9-11 attackers.

So come on, my fellow Capitalists. We are all safer in the middle. Let the pendulum swing right, and then left. And settle on the middle.

Furnishedowner



Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on March 31, 2009, 10:59:03 pm
Furnishedowner,

What I said was...

"Simply put, there is NOTHING the government can do FOR YOU that you cannot do FOR YOURSELF better."

I referring to how it relates to you from a Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness POV.  You read into that what you wanted... BTW, the things you listed, the government was/is exceedingly inefficient or ineffective at most if not all of them... 

The financial mess we are in now was a direct FAILURE of the seven different GOVERNMENT agencies who were given powers of oversight, as well as, the congressional subcommittee's who were also supposed to be on top of it...  And now the solution is to give them MORE money and MORE power to do that which they did not do in the first place?...

I think you like the "idea" of thinking you are a capitalist, but in reality, based on your posts on a host of things on these forums, you are more FOR government doing for you or others...

"It is just nonsense to say that because I am a Democrat I am in favor of EVERYTHING that the Democratic administration espouses."

OK, name for us five examples of what you disagree with Obama and the Dem's that have long-term negative ramifications for our country (there are a HOST to choose from). From what I and others have read, you're pretty much lock, stock and barrel along with the Democratic Administration.  It would also be interesting to see this from your perspective of "capitalist"....

Considering all the negative actions that he is taking, I especially would like to hear how you juxtapose your statement of - "I feel Obama  is doing a Hell of a good job in an incredibly difficult time. I am willing to give him time to right the ship.", with capitalism...

With regards to your statements about politicians who are "religious", and "Gott Mit Uns" - you have a short memory.. the Dem's were going out of their way in the past two election cycle's (due to polling) to associate with exactly that...

Obama - "I feel a righteous wind at our back"...

Obama - "Obama's call for help to "become an instrument of God."...

Obama - "Barack Obama distributes a campaign flier describing himself as a "Committed Christian" (1-21-08)."

Obama - "Barack Obama asked a congregation to help him "become an instrument of God" and join him in creating "a Kingdom right here on Earth" (10-17-07)"

Obama - "President OBAMA (in inaugural speech):  This is the source of our confidence, the knowledge that God calls on us to shape an uncertain destiny."


So come on my fellow capitalists, throw off the burden of government, stand up for your country's heritage and constitution, and free everyone else to be a "capitalist"...
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Vader on March 31, 2009, 11:10:02 pm
Vader,

"We need more posters who post from a different angle to bring back life to the site." - Thank you for making my point entirely!  You mean more posters who agree with your "angle", right?  Otherwise, you wouldn't care about other people's "angle", and just read them for what they are, an opposing view to yours... Then, when it's "weighted" towards your "angle" then others of the opposing view can make the same argument, right?

"If you build it....they will come" - the argument can be made that is already the case... you just don't like that they don't match your "angle"...

Wow...just wow, where to start... you read so hard into my post that you almost hurt yourself. Apparently you missed the part where I stated I'm neutral and don't care for politics. Too much of any one viewpoint/topic never goes anywhere and gets really boring and one dimensional. The SAME people post the SAME things over and over again.

You seem offended by what I said and I really don't see why. Apparently I touched a nerve and hurt your feelings. Not everyone sees the world as you do through political glasses, different strokes for different folks. So give your aggressive attitude a rest and go argue politics with someone who wants to talk about it.

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: justin0419 on March 31, 2009, 11:14:36 pm
I am very scared especially of religious fanaticism mixed with politics. When I choose someone to vote for, I lean towards the guy who does NOT start his resume with "Member of such-and-such church".  The person who can think and work things through rather than spout dogma.
Oh don't worry.  I'm sure every shred of anything having to do with God will be eradicated from all aspects of our government very soon.  
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on April 01, 2009, 02:15:15 pm
Vader...

"...I'm neutral and don't care for politics."

That's fine Vader, but if you are neutral (which I don't think you are), by definition, it shouldn't matter what others post, and REICLUB has a host of people posting from different POV's. If you don't "care for politics", why are you not only reading, but posting in a political thread?  It strains credulity to then say you are neutral...

"Too much of any one viewpoint/topic never goes anywhere and gets really boring and one dimensional."

That's only the case when you don't participate and put your thoughts on the subject out there.  Routinely different POV's spark different directions.  I challenge you to find one thread on REICLUB, or anywhere else for that matter, that is devoid of opposing views. A subject usually follows a 1/3 vs. 2/3 mentality, with it swinging both ways... Look at this thread... it's following the same pattern...

"The SAME people post the SAME things over and over again."

Continuity of thought will always breed repetition sometimes...  but I would rather know where you stand for something than wonder whether you go with the crowd and not think for yourself.

"You seem offended by what I said and I really don't see why. Apparently I touched a nerve and hurt your feelings..."

Actually no, Vader, I'm not "offended" or "hurt", but it does seem obvious that you are looking for more thought that agrees with your POV (and that's normal, BTW), otherwise you wouldn't care... after all, you're "neutral", right?...

"Not everyone sees the world as you do through political glasses, different strokes for different folks."

Granted, I don't just see the world though "political glasses", nor do I expect people to see things automatically from my POV, but in a thread with a political theme, people generally put on their "political glasses"... I intentionally listen to and read other POV's that differ from my own, and challenge what I believe.  It's one of the few ways you can really test what you truly believe, and not just blow with the wind.

"So give your aggressive attitude a rest and go argue politics with someone who wants to talk about it."

The thing that is amazing here, is that you claim neutrality, claim to invite different POV's, are posting in a political thread, and somehow expect not to get political argument which may disagree with your POV.  On top of that you exhort me to go "argue politics" (as if "arguing" politics in a political thread is out of the norm) with "someone who wants to talk about it".  How do you know that I am not already talking to someone who wants to hear it?  That's pretty presumptuous of you to assume otherwise... The funny thing is, Vader, you don't have to participate if you don't want to, or you can for that matter... you also could "change the channel" as it were (there are nine other forums on REICLUB other than Random Ramblings), but I would never tell you to take your POV, "aggressive" or otherwise, somewhere else, whether I disagreed with it or not... 

I wonder how you feel about the "fairness doctrine"...
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Vader on April 01, 2009, 02:33:51 pm
PositiveOutlook, you must really like to hear yourself talk. Let's see how many paragraphs you can write about this time. Go for it.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on April 01, 2009, 02:52:26 pm
That was a very weak way to avoid it Vader... BTW, one paragraph...  :biggrin
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Vader on April 01, 2009, 03:02:55 pm
No long winded response? You disappoint me.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on April 01, 2009, 03:05:47 pm
It's hard to respond to a non-response, Vader...  clarity of thought is routinely mistaken for being "long-winded"... I, however, wasn't disappointed...  Thank for making my point with your non-response...
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: justin0419 on April 01, 2009, 03:28:40 pm
One lined bickering could be better handled in PMs...
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: phlegmaticjay on April 03, 2009, 12:16:00 am
Quote
What if we had just waited on our benevolent citizenry in the South to let African-Americans share in the schools, jobs, hotel rooms, lunch counter seats? It took the government to enforce Civil Rights

Though signed by a Dem (LBJ), legislation was led by the Republicans of the time.  Something that the libs like to conveniently leave out.  Or the fact, that the KKK was created right after the Civil War by pissed off Southern Democrat governors.

I have always felt that the democrat mascot was a fitting one.....

The socialists started this movement in America right around the late 30's early 40's, and knew then that to transform the US into their "utopia" was going to require decades.  And they got their biggest boost from none other than Mr.  FDR himself, and the mistake called the "Great Society". 

How does a true Conservative fight moral relativism when any time you try to point out the hypocrisy, lies, half-truths, character assassinations,etc.  the immediate response from the media and socialists and (RINOs ) is to say that we are name calling!?!

As a conservative and son of a career Marine and former sailor myslf, I will to this day die defending your right to freedom of speech.
The typical Liberal Democrat's answer to this is "I don't like what you are saying, so I must ridicule you, demonize you and take any other measures necessary to shut you up."

Then we get to the 2nd Amendment.  And the Liberals basic argument of you don't need an assault rifle (which is a term in and of itself that is a joke) to hunt.  Or a semi-auto shotgun. Or a handgun.  Hunting isn't necessary for survival anymore.  Well we will let you keep your black powder rifles and single shot rifle and shotguns......GIVE ME A BREAK!  Reality check and yes I am going to say it.  The dirty little unspoken secret that everybody already knows and if you don't then, well, you really don't understand your American History.

Ready...The 2nd Amendment is meant to protect OUR ability to take back control of OUR country by force IF the government gets too powerful.  Do you really think when our Founding Fathers wer writing our Bill of Rights, they got done with Freedom of Speech and Right to Assemble and then suddenly realized Oh my God... we need to put in an amendment to allow the citizens to hunt!!  No, I just don't think so.

Ok, I apologize for the tangent, but this is a topic that is very near and dear to the heart, as I hope it is for all of you.  Yes, I have that antiquated, ridiculous, soooo-yesterday, feeling of true deep down burns in th soul patriotism and true love for my COUNTRY and our Constitution as it was written and how our Founding Fathers meant for it to be interpreted.  And I despise, DESPISE, socialists, liberals, progressives, communists, fascists or any other oppressive, life-sucking persons that want to change her into.  So yes, until I meet you, if you fall into this category I despise you.  Once I meet you , I may like you on a personal level, but I will still despise your beliefs.  And the real kicker... I will still give my life for you freedom to express them, even as you attempt to put people into power to silence me.......
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: rookieNYC on April 03, 2009, 06:58:22 am
And I despise, DESPISE, socialists, liberals, progressives, communists, fascists or any other oppressive, life-sucking persons that want to change her into.  So yes, until I meet you, if you fall into this category I despise you.  Once I meet you , I may like you on a personal level, but I will still despise your beliefs


Well said ....I agree %100...Excellent post...
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: furnishedowner on April 03, 2009, 02:07:59 pm
phlegmaticjay...You need a new handle for sure. I disagree, of course, with most of your very eloquent and impassioned political statement. But phlegmatic you are not.

I, too, sometimes find myself with tears upon hearing the national anthem. That is so hokey but true. I remember vividly my parent's naturalization ceremony where the judge then welcomed "The New Americans" and everyone stood up in the courtroom and clapped. I was eleven years old and so worried that my parents would not be able to answer the question correctly:  "Who is the president of the United States today?" Of course they knew, what a relief!

Also PositiveOutlook, another misnomer. I have only heard "NegativeOutlook" for a while. How about some positive vibes?

The fact that we are so varied in out viewpoints and yet love our country equally says a lot for the healthy functioning of this democracy, doesn't it?

Furnishedowner
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Funder on April 03, 2009, 06:17:26 pm
Quote
I am very scared especially of religious fanaticism mixed with politics. When I choose someone to vote for, I lean towards the guy who does NOT start his resume with "Member of such-and-such church".  The person who can think and work things through rather than spout dogma.

Oh don't worry.  I'm sure every shred of anything having to do with God will be eradicated from all aspects of our government very soon. 

I can't wait.

Kudos, furnishedowner, the truth is in the dialogue.
We have lost the ability to think.  We have lost control of our country.
Look at your financial statements throughout your life.  Who received the lion’s share of your money?  The government and the banks.  Now they need more?  It’s pathetic.
George Bush should be admired for waging a war on a willful act of evil.  He should be admired for attacking one form of theocracy, a practice which should be abolished in all governments.
But our liberal media could not drag his name thorough the mud enough. 
Lee Kuan Yew turned Singapore from a poor third world country to one of the wealthiest nations in the world.  His savvy political position allied itself with America, kept China form territorial occupation, and kept Japan and Russia as alliances, not foes.  Here are a couple of  quotes from him:

“nobody has ever sued me for libel because I do not defame my enemies.”

“If you keep on mocking your leader, and poking fun at him every day and he has no right of reply, it is very difficult for him to command your respect.”

This becomes like a blood feud between families.  Disrespect begets disrespect, hostility begets hostility, and we end up with people in power who don’t have any answers, just the ability to ridicule other people.  Nancy Pelosi is an excellent example:


Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction
technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process.
Nancy Pelosi

Protecting America from terrorism requires more than just resolve, it requires a plan. As we have seen in Iraq, planning is not the Bush Administration's strong suit.
Nancy Pelosi

I believe that the president's leadership and the actions taken in Iraq demonstrate an incompetence in terms of knowledge, judgment and experience.
Nancy Pelosi

The president led us into the Iraq war on the basis of unproven assertions without evidence; he embraced a radical doctrine of pre-emptive war unprecedented in our history; and he failed to build a true international coalition.
Nancy Pelosi

I pride myself in being called a liberal.
Nancy Pelosi

It’s strange how this person is admired for admitting that Saddam Hussein was “engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction” and yet “the president led us into the Iraq war on the basis of unproven assertions”  Again I feel compelled to ask what value she brings to our government.

The argument between socialism and capitalism is as old as politics and economics themselves.  If people believe in left wing economic policies, they ought to be offered the opportunity to become civil servants and have their ideas employed, if mandated by a free democracy.

Having said all of that, I have absolutely no faith in socialist economic policies.  It would be a refreshing change to see a conservative in the White House, since I don’t believe I have EVER seen a conservative in the administration.  Politicians cannot continue to spend, simply because it is expedient or popular, and expect to be recognized as fiscal conservatives.  Furthermore, Ayn Rand was one of the most intelligent conservative minds *ever*, and she was an atheist.  We need to separate church from government, or we are no better than the misogynistic, hateful, sponsors of terrorism who allow Muslim Mullahs to run their governments.

I would like to quote a few more people:

A government that is big enough to give you all you want is big enough to take it all away.
Barry Goldwater

Money is a tool of exchange, which can’t exist unless there are goods produced and men able to produce them.  Money is the material shape of the principle that men who wish to deal with one another must deal by trade and give value for value.  Money is not the tool for the moochers, who claim your product by tears, or of the looters, who take t form you by force.  Money is make possible only by the men who produce.
Ayn Rand

If I could not go to heaven but with a party, I would not go there at all.
Thomas Jefferson
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: phlegmaticjay on April 03, 2009, 07:49:10 pm
Furnishedowner,

I have a feeling, though it appears you lean left, it is not to the liberal left.  I may be wrong but I think maybe you may be more of a conservative democrat, which I can respect.  You are not ridiculing us conservatives on this post.  At least not publicly...... :smile  If you ever are in SW Michigan for some reason, get hold of me and if you a drinker I'll buy the beer and I'll give you a shot at converting me   :beer

As far as me being phlegmatic, it just so happens that the current subject is one of the few subjects that I get heated about.  BTW,  I think you are the only person that has commented on my handle, on any website forum and NOT think it has to do with spit.   :biggrin   

Yes I am actually pretty phlegmatic, which is probably part of the reason I have trouble in selling a concept or product.    I sucked at selling cars.   Anyway, this is off topic and I don't want to hijack this VERY important string.   

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: furnishedowner on April 03, 2009, 08:30:38 pm
Phlegmaticjay,

The beer sounds great. Who knows, I may get up there sometimes.  I get mental pictures of people from their writing, but I know that I am probably WAY off.  It would be actually fun to meet you, rookienyc, propertymanager, and you other raving conservatives in a dark little bar and hash this all out!  But I'm gonna need someone on my side, Vader?, too.

I still have problems with the "I HATE LIBERALS" shtick.  I don't hate conservatives, or anyone (well, ok, Rush Limbaugh-- his non-productive negative vitriol nauseates me).  But I feel just as strongly in my viewpoint as you all do. You do not have the market on patriotism.

My proud, self-reliant lifetime Democrat Dad would NEVER have considered taking a handout from the government or anyone else.  Even to suggest that is an affront to that hard-working man.

All this has made me ponder what DO I really believe? So here it is, whether you are interested or not:

NO to the death sentence. It demeans the sentencing society.
YES to 1st Trimester Abortion.  It's between the woman and her physician.  NO to 2nd Trimester Abortion unless to save mother's life, another medico/legal decision. YES to Gay Marriage, Gays did not choose their homosexuality, it's genetic. They deserve spousal rights and responsibilities. This doesn't affect heterosexual marriage one whit. Let's keep the government out of our bedrooms! If you're in love you can get  married! And divorced.

YES to much tighter gun control. It's absolutely crazy to allow any crazy to own and use a gun! They should be regulated, taxed, and licensed to stop our home-grown killing fields. Do what Europe does.

YES to sin taxes (cigarettes, alcohol, gambling) to fund national health programs, and the huge cost to society for the misuse. YES to National Health Care of one kind or another so that people stay healthy and do not get bankrupted by unexpected pancreatic cancer, or a premature baby.

YES to getting our military in there to mop up the 9-11 masterminds at long last, in the right country please.
YES to voucher to put your kid in private school if your local school sucks.

That's it for now. You can gnash your teeth over this liberal mindset while I am off to the big city-- dinner, and the Opera! A once or twice a year treat.

Furnishedowner

 

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: brockovich on April 03, 2009, 08:52:16 pm
Our founding fathers would be rolling(if not cartwheeling) in their graves if they even had a hint of some of the things going on in this country right now. Our government is so out of control I'm not sure it can ever be fixed short of hitting a reset button. Until the government is held to a standard and complies to a break even budget operation things will never get better. Big government does not work. Period, no matter what the political philosphies. The two party system is corrupt on both sides and nobody is interesting in fixing problems. They are simply interested in re-election and serving their own self interests.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on April 03, 2009, 09:05:44 pm
Furnishedowner,

Positveoutlook is a personal philosophy, not a one-sided monicker.  As with most things, including politics, I call it as I see it, and Obama and his administration, along with their Dem allies in Congress are causing more damage to this country in their current pursuits, I don't know how you could frame it in a positive light.

If liberals hate the banks, and the AIG's so much, why are you allowing Obama to continue to lend/give them OUR money only to have them loan it BACK TO US at more interest, and have our children foot the bill to boot?  We were told GM/Chrysler COULDN'T be allowed to go to bankruptcy, and yet, they will, AFTER we lost MORE BILLIONS!  If you think this is ludicruous, just wait until Nationalized Healthcare or when Cap and Trade adds $150-$300 PER MONTH to your electric bill.  Bet those ELECTRIC CARS will be just dandy to have then...

As far as you being a conservative democrat, I have to break with Phlegmaticjay as I have yet to see the evidence of it...  this is nothing personal, mind you, but an observation.  You've yet to even provide the five examples of where you disagree with Obama/Dem's, and I think that would shed light on where your potential conservative dem credentials may lie...  There is no doubt that Obama is ultra-liberal, just as his RECORD indicated, and just as everyone who exhorted people who got suckered into voting for him being portrayed otherwise tried to warn them...

You remember the accountant and her mechanic husband, right?...  Here was a classic example of how liberals think.  You had someone who works for you complaining that they had to make  choice between food/electric and healtcare that month ($500 I believe), and despite recommendations for you to put your money where your mouth was and either loan it to her, gift it to her, etc.  it just went on they then she told you that she was able to cover it. In the void of you offering her financial help, I stepped in offered multiple times to provide her help in the form of hooking her up with local services for her electric, food, etc.  and ways to decrease their costs.  But it turned out not to be as bad as portrayed (which is what liberals do - create a crises), and I never heard from anyone.  Your solution was "free" healthcare so she could pay her food and electric bill, while her husband's business was slow.  But that "free" healthcare (which is false anyway) falls on the back of someone else.  You just didn't want it to be "your" back that month...

Funder...

Religous people in government is not a bad thing... just ask our Founding Fathers... A state/government sponsored religion IS a bad thing as it dichotomous to the "free exercise thereof" of religion...  you cannot "establish a religion" in government if people are "free to exercise" their own religion...

On balance, I would rather have someone in office who's belief is that they will answer to a Higher-Authority one day vs. someone who doesn't believe they ultimately answer to anyone, and ultimately make up their "own moral code" because they came from ooze and after all, who are you to then deny them of whatever erotic desire they want, EVEN IF it conflicts with yours...

“I want this world not to have meaning because it frees me for my own erotic pursuits”. - Famous Atheist - Aldous Huxley -  “A brave New World”

"We have solved, by fair experiment, the great and interesting question whether freedom of religion is compatible with order in government and obedience to the laws. And we have experienced the quiet as well as the comfort which results from leaving every one to profess freely and openly those principles of religion which are the inductions of his own reason and the serious convictions of his own inquiries." --Thomas Jefferson: Reply to Virginia Baptists, 1808

"The constitutional freedom of religion [is] the most inalienable and sacred of all human rights." --Thomas Jefferson: Virginia Board of Visitors Minutes, 1819

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Funder on April 05, 2009, 03:52:07 am
First, I apologize to Rookie for the semi-hijack of this thread, this is something which ignites my passion.

Quote
Religous people in government is not a bad thing... just ask our Founding Fathers...

Good idea
“Religious controversies are always productive of more acrimony and irreconcilable hatreds than those which spring from any other cause. I had hoped that liberal and enlightened thought would have reconciled the Christians so that their religious fights would not endanger the peace of Society.”
George Washington
“Some volumes against Deism fell into my hands. They were said to be the substance of sermons preached at Boyle’s Lecture. It happened that they produced on me an effect precisely the reverse of what was intended by the writers; for the arguments of the Deists, which were cited in order to be refuted, appealed to me much more forcibly than the refutation itself. In a word, I soon became a thorough Deist.”
Benjamin Franklin
“I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature.”
Thomas Jefferson
“During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What has been its fruits? More or less, in all places, pride and indolence in the clergy; ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry, and persecution.”
James Madison
"The government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."
John Adams
"My earlier views of the unsoundness of the Christian scheme of salvation and the human origin of the scriptures have become clearer and stronger with advancing years, and I see no reason for thinking I shall ever change them."
Abraham Lincoln

Quote
On balance, I would rather have someone in office who's belief is that they will answer to a Higher-Authority one day vs. someone who doesn't believe they ultimately answer to anyone, and ultimately make up their "own moral code" because they came from ooze

I would rather have someone in office who did not believe that whatever sins they decided to commit would be forgiven by God.

I would rather have someone in office who did not belong to a religion that is responsible for The Crusades, literally a thousand years of war and murder in the name of God.

Why did radical Islamic jihad terrorists fly jet planes into buildings?  Because they thought a higher authority or, more precisely an unknowable higher authority, wanted them to.

I would rather have someone in office who believed in science, collecting data, analyzing data and drawing conclusions based upon the data, than someone who believes in magic.

I would rather have someone in office who would hold themselves personally accountable for their ethical behavior, than someone who believes in eternal damnation for anyone who doesn’t happen to agree with their unknowable, improvable religion.

Quote
who are you to then deny them of whatever erotic desire they want, EVEN IF it conflicts with yours...

Right.  Thank God the Mormon church has the strength of moral conviction to deny the Gays of their ability to get married.  Since that conflicts with their moral code of fascism.

I’m sure I’ll never personally see my wish, but I would rather have someone who admits to being an atheist in the White House, but that would compromise the evangelical Christian vote.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on April 05, 2009, 12:46:35 pm
Funder,

Your post is exemplory of the dumbing down of the American populace with regards to it's heritage and history. It also shows that your problem is with Christianity not necessarily religious leaders....

As far as government without religion...

"We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry, would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." --October 11, 1798 - Jonh Adams

“ The general principles upon which the Fathers achieved independence were the general principals of Christianity… I will avow that I believed and now believe that those general principles of Christianity are as eternal and immutable as the existence and attributes of God.” - John Adams

“ God governs in the affairs of man. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without his notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without His aid? We have been assured in the Sacred Writings that except the Lord build the house, they labor in vain that build it. I firmly believe this. I also believe that, without His concurring aid, we shall succeed in this political building no better than the builders of Babel” –Constitutional Convention of 1787 | original manuscript of this speech - Benjamin Franklin

"For my own part, I sincerely esteem it [the Constitution] a system which without the finger of God, never could have been suggested and agreed upon by such a diversity of interests." - [1787 after the Constitutional Convention] - Alexamder Hamilton

“It cannot be emphasized too clearly and too often that this nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religion, but on the gospel of Jesus Christ. For this very reason, peoples of other faiths have been afforded asylum, prosperity, and freedom of worship here.”   - Patrick Henry

“Providence has given to our people the choice of their rulers, and it is the duty, as well as the privilege and interest of our Christian nation to select and prefer Christians for their rulers.” Source: October 12, 1816. The Correspondence and Public Papers of John Jay, Henry P. Johnston, ed., (New York: Burt Franklin, 1970), Vol. IV, p. 393. - John Jay

“We have staked the whole future of American civilization, not upon the power of government, far from it. We’ve staked the future of all our political institutions upon our capacity…to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God.” - [1778 to the General Assembly of the State of Virginia] - james Madison

"Religion is the basis and Foundation of Government." - June 20, 1785 - James Madison

• In 1812, President Madison signed a federal bill which economically aided the Bible Society of Philadelphia in its goal of the mass distribution of the Bible.


"At the Constitutional Convention of 1787, James Madison proposed the plan to divide the central government into three branches. He discovered this model of government from the Perfect Governor, as he read Isaiah 33:22"

“The Bible was America’s basic textbook in all fields.” - [Noah Webster. Our Christian Heritage p.5]

"...reason and experience both forbid us to expect, that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle..." - George Washington, Farewell Address

“ It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and Bible.” - George Washington

George Washington took his inaugural oath as prescribed by the Constitution but ADDED religious components to the ceremony.  He ordered a Bible on which to take the oath, and added "So help me God!" at the end.... this practice has continued throughout our country's existense, including our current President.

Liberty Bell Inscription:
“ Proclaim liberty throughout the land and to all the inhabitants thereof” [Leviticus 25:10]

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For this very reason peoples of other faiths have been afforded asylum, prosperity, and freedom of worship here." - Patrick Henry

Funder,

The point of all these quotes are that America was founded on Christian principles, and our society is replete with many examples... from the Declaration of Independence, to inscriptions on our national buildings and monuments, the Ten Commandments hanging in the Supreme Court, the inscription on our money, our Presidents swearing on a Bible, our Pledge of Allegiance, etc...

Is America excusively a Christian nation... no, but to deny it's heritage and history does noone any justice... By definition, it certainly isn't an atheist country, but you are certainly free to your non-exercise of religion...  Just don't pretend that, like America, Christianity hasn't done much more good than bad... the same can't be said of atheism...

Consider that over 170 million people died at the hands of atheists like Lenin, Stalin, and others over the last century alone and more peope died in Cambodia during the rule of Pol Pot, the atheist, in just a few short years than Christians who harmed each other in over 2,000 years.

As an atheist, what do you base your rights in America on?  Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness are inscribed as inalienable rights by the "Creator" in the Declaration of Independence.  If you do not recognize God, what do you base your rights on?  If you are going to say the laws of the land, they are grounded in the former.

The problem with atheism, is that it is a religion, but with YOU as god, with YOU being the ultimate arbiter of right and wrong... If you believe this is the case, you can ultimately do whatever you want (if not, why not?), including the removal of rights of another. Hungry, and don't have any food, TAKE it from someone else... why not? Without God, there is no ultimate accountability to anything, right?

You have to ignore the many miracles that exist in this universe and all around you on a daily basis to be an atheist...

"The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God." - Psalm 14:1

So, I don't withhold from you the right to not believe in God and I would simply ask that you not deny anyone else the right TO believe and feel free to exercise their beliefs...
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: phlegmaticjay on April 05, 2009, 08:35:28 pm
Again, die to defend, and get ridiculed for Believing 

Excellent post  PositiveOutlook
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Funder on April 05, 2009, 08:39:28 pm
Quote
Your post is exemplory of the dumbing down of the American populace with regards to it's heritage and history.

If you portray America’s heritage as having been filled with dogmatic Christian vanity, then you misrepresent our true history.

Quote
your problem is with Christianity

How true

Quote
The point of all these quotes are that America was founded on Christian principles, and our society is replete with many examples... from the Declaration of Independence, to inscriptions on our national buildings and monuments, the Ten Commandments hanging in the Supreme Court, the inscription on our money, our Presidents swearing on a Bible, our Pledge of Allegiance, etc...

I do, of course, acknowledge the pervasive presence of Christianity in our culture.  I believe that most people in America who call themselves Christians would actually fall more appropriately under the description of Deism, described by Benjamin Franklin in my post above.

The vast majority of the art in the supreme court building deals with justice, fairness, and the simultaneous governance and preservation of rights of  the people in a society.  The architecture is obviously  Romanesque and Greek in it’s origins, and most of the art which depicts people, represents the people of Greece and Rome, the civilizations which dramatically furthered the ideology of democracy and representative republic.

“In God We Trust” was not always on our currency, It was initially suggested by a reverend during the Civil War.

The original pledge of allegiance was written in 1892 and read:  “I pledge allegiance to my Flag and the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.”

The Knights of Columbus campaigned to add the words “under God” to the pledge of allegiance to the American flag, and Congress changed the pledge in 1954.  The Knights of Columbus, by the way, were the largest contributors to the California proposition 8 campaign to ban same sex marriage, having used nearly 1.3 million dollars of the Roman Catholic Church’s money to impose their religious code through the use of  legislative mandate.  Is this separation of church and state?

James Madison drafted the Virginia Plan, and having done so, made himself the primary author and inspiration behind the Constitution of the United States of America.  He believed in a citizens right to own firearms to protect citizens from tyranny and oppression by the government.  He also believed in the abolition of the death penalty.  He was also a strident atheist.  He believed in individual rights, and supported separation of church and state.
Quote
The problem with atheism, is that it is a religion, but with YOU as god, with YOU being the ultimate arbiter of right and wrong... If you believe this is the case, you can ultimately do whatever you want (if not, why not?), including the removal of rights of another. Hungry, and don't have any food, TAKE it from someone else... why not? Without God, there is no ultimate accountability to anything, right?

You have to ignore the many miracles that exist in this universe and all around you on a daily basis to be an atheist...

"The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God." - Psalm 14:1

We all need to develop personal convictions between what is right and what is wrong .  You assume that since a person does not derive his entire moral framework by the man at the front of the church, or by Constantine’s random collection of books, that they have no ethics.  That is both bigoted and insulting.

     You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the
     only way, it does not exist.
                                                                                                        Friedrich Nietzsche
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Funder on April 05, 2009, 08:45:17 pm
Quote
Again, die to defend, and get ridiculed for Believing

Not all American Soldiers are Christians.
Defending the right to free speech and one's spiritual orientation are two things.
I never ridiculed anyone on this thread.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: phlegmaticjay on April 05, 2009, 09:24:52 pm
That would be to die defending your FREEDOM OF RELIGION or even lack thereof.  The fact is however that our country was in fact based on Christian principles.   And yet, the language is written, to allow all religions to practice their customs and beliefs (within reason).   
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: furnishedowner on April 07, 2009, 12:46:47 pm
Funder,

Very well said. I am 100% in agreement that we need separation of church and state. That may be the most important liberty of all.  Keep religious dogma away from our laws.

Furnishedowner
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Rich_in_CT on April 07, 2009, 01:00:37 pm
Funder,

Very well said. I am 100% in agreement that we need separation of church and state. That may be the most important liberty of all.  Keep religious dogma away from our laws.

Furnishedowner
:beer

If religion changes how laws are written we can never truly be free religiously speaking.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on April 08, 2009, 08:03:56 am
Funder,

Buildings, money, etc. - you missed the point entirely... the original Declaration of Indepedance started with the abolition of slavery, but later was changed... it is not the "original", it is the one ultimately decided upon that is pertainent...  These things would not have the "religous markings" as it were, if it were not part of the country's heritage.  It is there throughout government... and if the Ten Commandments were just artwork, the Supreme Court, the halls of Congress, the Presidential Oath, etc. would all not have prayer.  They do, and it is silly to argue that it is not, and continues to be, part of our heritage.

Whether or not Madison was an atheist based on his writings is debateable, but I will just let that stand for now.  That being said, he was the most fiercest defender of free exercise of religion...

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123714297334033741.html

“We have staked the whole future of American civilization, not upon the power of government, far from it. We’ve staked the future of all our political institutions upon our capacity…to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God.” - [1778 to the General Assembly of the State of Virginia] - James Madison

"Religion is the basis and Foundation of Government." - June 20, 1785 - James Madison

Kind of a wiered thing for an athesit to not only say but defend....

As far atheism goes, when you say Funder - "We all need to develop personal convictions between what is right and what is wrong ", the problem with it is that it relies solely on man's sense of what's right and wrong, and who are you to say what is right or what is wrong?  If I feel it is OK to follolw "nature's law" of the survival of the fittest, and TAKE what ever I want from whomever I want because I can, who are you to say that I can't if I am an atheist? Especially is you are going to quote Nietzsche?
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: jfpen on April 11, 2009, 06:22:59 am


All this has made me ponder what DO I really believe? So here it is, whether you are interested or not:

NO to the death sentence. It demeans the sentencing society.
YES to 1st Trimester Abortion.  It's between the woman and her physician.  NO to 2nd Trimester Abortion unless to save mother's life, another medico/legal decision. YES to Gay Marriage, Gays did not choose their homosexuality, it's genetic. They deserve spousal rights and responsibilities. This doesn't affect heterosexual marriage one whit. Let's keep the government out of our bedrooms! If you're in love you can get  married! And divorced.

YES to much tighter gun control. It's absolutely crazy to allow any crazy to own and use a gun! They should be regulated, taxed, and licensed to stop our home-grown killing fields. Do what Europe does.

YES to sin taxes (cigarettes, alcohol, gambling) to fund national health programs, and the huge cost to society for the misuse. YES to National Health Care of one kind or another so that people stay healthy and do not get bankrupted by unexpected pancreatic cancer, or a premature baby.

YES to getting our military in there to mop up the 9-11 masterminds at long last, in the right country please.
YES to voucher to put your kid in private school if your local school sucks.

That's it for now. You can gnash your teeth over this liberal mindset while I am off to the big city-- dinner, and the Opera! A once or twice a year treat.

Furnishedowner


Furndishedowner,
             
                  Just a thought- 
 As DNA testing technology advances, should a mother have the right to terminate her pregnancy if a DNA test says the baby will be homosexual?
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: jfpen on April 11, 2009, 06:37:48 am

All this has made me ponder what DO I really believe? So here it is, whether you are interested or not:

 
YES to much tighter gun control. It's absolutely crazy to allow any crazy to own and use a gun! They should be regulated, taxed, and licensed to stop our home-grown killing fields. Do what Europe does.


Furnishedowner

 

Furnishedowner,
                     You no doubt have good intentions. Here's a good article.


Gun Control Myths: Gun Restrictions and Murder Rates
by Thomas Sowell  (November 27, 2002)

Talking facts to gun control zealots is only likely to make them angry. But the rest of us need to know what the facts are. More than that, we need to know that much of what the gun controllers claim as facts will not stand up under scrutiny.

The grand dogma of the gun controllers is that places with severe restrictions on the ownership of firearms have lower rates of murder and other gun crimes. How do they prove this? Simple. They make comparisons of places where this is true and ignore all comparisons of places where the opposite is true.

Gun control zealots compare the United States and England to show that murder rates are lower where restrictions on ownership of firearms are more severe. But you could just as easily compare Switzerland and Germany, the Swiss having lower murder rates than the Germans, even though gun ownership is three times higher in Switzerland. Other countries with high rates of gun ownership and low murder rates include Israel, New Zealand and Finland.

Within the United States, rural areas have higher rates of gun ownership and lower rates of murder, whites have higher rates of gun ownership than blacks and much lower murder rates. For the country as a whole, handgun ownership doubled in the late 20th century, while the murder rate went down. But such facts are not mentioned by gun control zealots or by the liberal media.

Another dogma among gun control supporters is that having a gun in the home for self-defense is futile and is only likely to increase the chances of your getting hurt or killed. Your best bet is to offer no resistance to an intruder, according to this dogma.

Actual research tells just the opposite story. People who have not resisted have gotten hurt twice as often as people who resisted with a firearm. Those who resisted without a firearm of course got hurt the most often.

Such facts are simply ignored by gun control zealots. They prefer to cite a study published some years ago in the New England Journal of Medicine and demolished by a number of scholars since then. According to this discredited study, people with guns in their homes were more likely to be murdered.

How did they arrive at this conclusion? By taking people who were murdered in their homes, finding out how many had guns in the house, and then comparing them with people who were not murdered in their homes.

Using similar reasoning, you might be able to show that people who hire bodyguards are more likely to get killed than people who don't. Obviously, people who hire bodyguards already feel at risk, but does that mean that the bodyguards are the reason for the risk?

Similarly illogical reasoning has been used by counting how many intruders were killed by homeowners with guns and comparing that with the number of family members killed with those guns. But this is a nonsense comparison because most people who keep guns in their homes do not do so in hopes of killing intruders.

Most uses of guns in self-defense -- whether in the home or elsewhere -- do not involve actually pulling the trigger. When the intended victim turns out to have a gun in his hand, the attacker usually has enough brains to back off. But the lives saved this way do not get counted.

People killed at home by family members are highly atypical. The great majority of these victims have had to call the police to their homes before, because of domestic violence, and just over half have had the cops out several times. These are not just ordinary people who happened to lose their temper when a gun was at hand.

Neither are most "children" who are killed by guns just toddlers who happened to find a loaded weapon lying around. More of those "children" are members of teenage criminal gangs who kill each other deliberately.

Some small children do in fact get accidentally killed by guns in the home -- but fewer than drown in bathtubs. Is anyone for banning bathtubs? Moreover, the number of fatal gun accidents fell, over the years, while the number of guns was increasing by tens of millions. None of this supports the assumption that more guns mean more fatal accidents.

Most of the gun controllers' arguments are a house of cards.

No wonder they don't want any hard facts coming near them.


Thomas Sowell has published a large volume of writing. His dozen books, as well as numerous articles and essays, cover a wide range of topics, from classic economic theory to judicial activism, from civil rights to choosing the right college.

Please contact your local newspaper editor if you want to read the THOMAS SOWELL column in your hometown paper.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: phlegmaticjay on April 11, 2009, 08:23:49 am
Nailed it.  Forgot to mention that as a rule states that have looser gunlaws have lower violent crime rates.  The exception within those states, is if it has a major metropolitan area( Phoenix, Detroit,)
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: furnishedowner on April 13, 2009, 10:29:20 am
jfpen,

If homosexuality is a normal variant in human beings, as it appears to be, why would anyone want to terminate that? Would you terminate a left-handed child because your entire family is right-handed?

I lived in Switzerland and I am familiar with their "gun in every house".  The entire male population is basically their National Guard. But it is ONE gun, not the massive amount of armaments that U.S. gun-lovers have on hand. Also it is a country with an excellent health and mental health system. People with mental illness get treated;  they don't go out and buy guns at gun shows to wipe out their local post office, school, or family.

Talk to Europeans about our gun-kill rates...they are horrified. "Why don't you change it?" they keep asking.

Didn't George Bush repeal Clinton's assault rifle ban? Now that's a weapon that belongs ONLY in the hands of military and police.

We need some sanity here. Let's license and control guns and not allow crazies to buy them unhindered.

Furnishedowner
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: jfpen on April 13, 2009, 12:14:54 pm
jfpen,

If homosexuality is a normal variant in human beings, as it appears to be, why would anyone want to terminate that? Would you terminate a left-handed child because your entire family is right-handed?



Now you're thinking!!!

JP
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: jfpen on April 13, 2009, 12:28:54 pm
jfpen,



I lived in Switzerland and I am familiar with their "gun in every house".  The entire male population is basically their National Guard. But it is ONE gun, not the massive amount of armaments that U.S. gun-lovers have on hand. Also it is a country with an excellent health and mental health system. People with mental illness get treated;  they don't go out and buy guns at gun shows to wipe out their local post office, school, or family.

Talk to Europeans about our gun-kill rates...they are horrified. "Why don't you change it?" they keep asking.

Didn't George Bush repeal Clinton's assault rifle ban? Now that's a weapon that belongs ONLY in the hands of military and police.

We need some sanity here. Let's license and control guns and not allow crazies to buy them unhindered.

Furnishedowner

Hitler was for gun control. It didn't work out so well for the Jews.



Here's another good article:

From the WSJ Opinion Archives
BLOWN AWAY
Gun Control Misfires in Europe
What's behind the massacres in Germany, France and Switzerland?

by JOHN R. LOTT JR.
Saturday, May 4, 2002 12:01 A.M. EDT

Sixteen people were killed during last week's school shooting in Germany. This follows the killing of 14 regional legislators in Zug, a Swiss canton, last September, and the massacre of eight city council members in a Paris suburb last month. The three worst public shootings in the Western world during the past year all occurred in Europe, whose gun laws are exactly what gun-control advocates want the U.S. to adopt. Indeed, all three occurred in gun-free "safe zones."

Germans who wish to get hold of a hunting rifle must undergo checks that can last a year, while those wanting a gun for sport must be a member of a club and obtain a license from the police. The French must apply for gun permits, which are granted only after an exhaustive background and medical record check and demonstrated need, with permits only valid for three years. Even Switzerland's once famously liberal laws have become tighter. Swiss federal law now limits gun permits to only those who can demonstrate in advance a need for a weapon to protect themselves or others against a precisely specified danger.

The problem with such laws is that they take away guns from law-abiding citizens, while would-be criminals ignore them, leaving potential victims defenseless. The U.S. has shown that making guns more available is actually a better formula for law and order.

America has seen a major change from 1985, when just eight states had the most liberal right-to-carry laws, which automatically grant permits once applicants pass a criminal background check, pay their fees and in some cases complete a training class. Today the total is 33 states. Deaths and injuries from multiple-victim public shootings fell on average by 78% in states that passed such laws.

In Europe, by contrast, violent crime is rising. Many factors are responsible, but it's clear that strict gun control laws aren't helping.

In 1996, Britain banned handguns. The ban was so tight that even shooters training for the Olympics were forced to travel to other countries to practice. In the six years since the ban, gun crimes have risen by an astounding 40%. Britain now leads the U.S. by a wide margin in robberies and aggravated assaults. Although murder and rape rates are still lower than in the U.S., the difference is shrinking quickly. Dave Rogers, vice chairman of the Metropolitan Police Federation, said that despite the ban, "the underground supply of guns does not seem to have dried up at all."

Australia also passed severe gun restrictions in 1996, banning most guns and making it a crime to use a gun defensively. In the subsequent four years, armed robberies rose by 51%, unarmed robberies by 37%, assaults by 24%, and kidnappings by 43%. While murders fell by 3%, manslaughter rose by 16%.

And both Britain and Australia have been thought to be ideal places for gun control because they are surrounded by water, making gun smuggling relatively difficult. By contrast smuggling is much easier on the Continent or within the U.S.

Gun-control advocates frequently ignore another inconvenient fact: Many countries with high homicide rates have gun bans. It is hard to think of a much more draconian police state than the former Soviet Union, with a ban on guns that dated back to the communist revolution. Yet newly released data show that from 1976 to 1985 the U.S.S.R.'s homicide rate was between 21% and 41% higher than that of the U.S.

Many French politicians complained during their presidential election that the shooting in Paris meant "it's getting like in America, and we don't want to see that here." Americans may draw a different lesson from the evidence, and hope that they don't become more like the Europeans.

Mr. Lott is a resident scholar at the American Enterprise Institute and the author of "More Guns, Less Crime" (University of Chicago Press, 2000).

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on April 13, 2009, 12:29:37 pm
Furnishedowner,

The problem is it "sounds" good, but in reality it is not effectual...

I will say one thing... from what I've read here, you're quite the world traveler, with health care, gun control, etc. all being better everywhere else you lived (which is bogus, IMHO) and yet you chose to live here in the USA, where all these issues are substandard according to your posts...

"Now that's a weapon [assault rifle] that belongs ONLY in the hands of military and police." - Problem is those pesky people who IGNORE the laws called criminals who will get their hands on them whether they are legal or not.

Despite what you see on TV, criminals use these type of weapons very little, as they are hard to conceal.  In fact, more deaths using these types of weapons are from police use rather than the other way around.

If you do a basic search on the subject, you'll find you are just parroting the media speak out there regarding guns in general.  Do you know that you are statistically five times more likely to be stabbed to death vs. being shot by an automatic gun?  Now what?  Do we ban all butcher knives? Or do we continue to allow LAW ABIDING CITIZENS (or mentally stable) to buy WHATEVER type of knife they want?

If someone is going to kill you with a gun, and they can't get one, they will find another way. If they are going to kill themselves via a gun, and they can't get one, they will find another way.

Auto deaths outweigh gun deaths (combined), so why are you not proposing that cars be banned?

You would do yourself more justice and be better informed if you were to research BOTH sides of an issue before coming to a knee-jerk response...  Remember, gun stats are lumped together no matter the cause (i.e. - criminal activity, self-defense, suicide, etc.).
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on April 13, 2009, 12:40:51 pm
With regards to "If homosexuality is a normal variant in human beings, as it appears to be, why would anyone want to terminate that? Would you terminate a left-handed child because your entire family is right-handed?"...

It's as arbitrary a reason as any other reason, ESPECIALLY if you an atheist, and ultimately make you own decisions, right Funder ?...  Families in China routinely abort SOLELY because it's a girl because of LIMITATIONS imposed on them from their government.  If you are going to say that is wrong, my question would be why? 

It's OK to abort because you are not "emotionally" or "financially" ready (which is usually not the case no matter when), but not if it is a lefty or a homosexual?  Would not both those conditions fall under being "emotionally" ready?

Your reasoning for this, and gun control, being that more CARS kill people than GUNS and abortions dwarfs them both... will be interesting...

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on April 13, 2009, 12:51:23 pm
BTW, I am left-handed... :biggrin
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on April 21, 2009, 01:31:21 pm
How do you come to a conclusion on a topic?  Do you rely on a knee-jerk reaction to things, do you follow the masses in potential fear of non-conformity, are you focused on being politically correct, do you leave open your opinions for revision... do you delve into it listening to opinions on both sides, rely on your upbringing... how do you come to a determination of what YOU actually believe?...
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 08, 2009, 10:19:32 pm
"I am 100% in agreement that we need separation of church and state. That may be the most important liberty of all.  Keep religious dogma away from our laws."

Furnishedowner



"...reason and experience both forbid us to expect, that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle..." -
George Washington, Farewell Address

“ It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and Bible.” - George Washington


Your position is in direct conflict with our first President who was the first to govern with the laws of the land…
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 10:16:05 am
George Washington was a living breathing contradiction on NUMEROUS subjects.

George Washington who spoke of the evils of SLAVERY, yet OWNED over 200 SLAVES and wouldn't have been able to build anywhere near the wealth he created without them.  He did NOTHING about slavery while President of the United States.   When Washington died his will declared that his then 300+ slaves would be freed ONLY upon the death of Washingtons wife.  This at a time when the Washington's were one of THE RICHEST families in the Country.

HOW GALANT!!!   How many of those slaves DIED in bondage while Washingtons wife lived out her remaining years in the lap of luxury.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 11:49:22 am
As if by Washington owning slaves that negates his principles in other areas...   :rolleyes   Your straw man does NOT change what I said... that Furnishedowners position was in contrast to Washingtons...



"We have no government armed in power capable of contending with human passions nbridled by morality and religion. Our Constitution was made only for a religious and moral people. It is wholly inadequate for the government of any other." - John Adams, 2nd President of the US

"The proscribing any citizen as unworthy the public confidence by laying upon him an incapacity of being called to offices of trust and emolument unless he profess or renounce this or that religious opinion is depriving him injuriously of those privileges and advantages to which, in common with his fellow citizens, he has a natural right." --Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the US

I could go on, but I think you get the point...  But according to your assertion FDjake, the fact that he owned slaves should also negate all his other principle positions...  :rolleyes  Of course, that would only be if they disagreed with your flawed supposition...  FYI, 8 out of 10 of our country's first 10 Presidents owned slaves while in office....

As the first President of America, Washington was conscious of the very real risk of splitting apart the young republic over slavery. He did not advocate the abolition of slavery while in office, but did sign legislation enforcing the prohibition of slavery in the Northwest Territory, so he did take steps... remember where he was living... in the south...

"After the Revolution, Washington told an English visitor, "I clearly foresee that nothing but the rooting out of slavery can perpetuate the existence of our [Federal] union by consolidating it on a common bond of principle."

"it being among my first wishes to see some plan adopted, by which slavery in this country may be abolished by slow, sure, and imperceptible degrees" - George Washington

10 years later - "There is not a man living who wishes more sincerely than I do to see some plan adopted for the gradual abolition of slavery"


He was dealing with political realities of the time...  His final act on the subject was freeing the slaves in his will, yes, after his wife's death...

"SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE"

The Founding Father's position on the concept of "separation of church and state" is clear... they all exhort that the state should NOT be allowed to hinder the free exercise of religion or establish a state religion, but they felt from the Declaration of Independance forward that our freedoms were based on unalienable rights ENDOWED by our Creator...  FREE EXERCISE not be abridged...

If you do not believe that our rights are endowed by our Creator, what do you base your rights on?  If you are going to argue our laws, they are based on the former...

Our HISTORY is our history, and it does their memory injustice to mispresent their beliefs...  the men and women, both free and slave who FOUGHT with their treasure and blood to this end, deserve more...



"Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence." - John Adams
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 12:19:31 pm
I simply pointed out that EVERYONE including our FOUNDING FATHERS have CONFLICTS regarding their BELIEFS vs their actual PRACTICES.

You constantly quote our founding fathers and I thought it interesting to see the REALITY of how LIVES were LIVED versus what these people WROTE or what was written about them.

It actually reminded me of YOU.  Someone who thinks in broad strokes and grand ideas but can't finish a simple project on time.


Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: christopher w on June 09, 2009, 12:31:26 pm
Positive,

They need to make a Bud light commercial for you.

"Real men of genius

Here's to you Mr.  ""Termite King"" defender of the right, master of the cut and paste guy.

You own a termite infested dump, but you would rather spend your time (NAY) waste your time arguing online with total strangers behind a fake name.

Mr.  "Termite King" defender of the right, master of the cut and paste guy."
 (Sung to the tune of Real Men of genius)





Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 12:46:42 pm
Chris,

That was OUTSTANDING!!!!!!

I think I may have passed out for a few seconds from LAUGHING so hard!!!

 :beer :beer :beer :beer :beer




Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hooch on June 09, 2009, 01:11:51 pm
You constantly quote our founding fathers and I thought it interesting to see the REALITY of how LIVES were LIVED versus what these people WROTE or what was written about them.

So you are saying that they wrote one thing that they knew would be best for the country BUT lived a completely different way. And what they WROTE is meaningless as they didn't live that way.

FD, I would love for you to actually base what you are writing on factual information as Positive is. That way we can get to the bottom of things.

And Chris, the termite thing again... give it up. As you know, he is making money on the house. EVERY experienced investor has found hidden problems after they bought a house. Anyone would say otherwise is either a lair or an amateur.

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 01:23:43 pm
You want FACTS????  Here's the FACTS....

WASHINGTON owned OVER 200 SLAVES while he WROTE about how bad it was....He did absolutely NOTHING about slavery while President.  Those are called FACTS!!!

People write what they WANT others to believe......What they DO, shows us how they REALLY lived their lives.

THAT HOOCH is called a FACT!!!   If I tell a group that stealing is wrong and I'm stealing from them as they sit there....What I SAY is just BULLSH*T.......What I'm DOING really shows these people what type of person I am.

You can make stats and facts say whatever you want them to say.  You can cut and paste quote after quote after quote.  IN the end ALL that matters is what you actually DO.....Not what you SAY should be done.

Everything else is just SPIN.

The Republican party lost The White House, the House of Reps and the Senate because American people got sick of being told ONE THING while the EXACT OPPPOSITE was done right in front of their eyes.




Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 01:37:49 pm
Hooch, let them talk...  they BOTH jump to their straw men of personal insults that have NOTHING to do with the subject at hand...

"Termite-infested" - It was along the outer rim of the house (approximately 10-13 feet) which did no structural damage...  so not exactly "infested"...   :rolleyes

Christopher, I am not aware of you being an active real estate investor... are you?


"but you would rather spend your time (NAY) waste your time arguing online with total strangers behind a fake name"

I've already expounded on my schedule for this project... point is, I will make what the self-appointed great FDjake made on his flip that cost him MORE money to get the same result...  must be killing him that the rookie's numbers were better than his...  which is why I suspect he tries to demean it so often and will continue to do so...  he can't help himself...

No matter, EVERYONE sees it for what it is...  Childish school-yard banter by someone supposedly in their 40's....   :rolleyes


"Someone who thinks in broad strokes and grand ideas but can't finish a simple project on time"

My thoughts are specific, and as far as "on time" that is based on my schedule and specifics, not your's... 

What is laughable is that they both criticize both of us for spending time on this site, when they both spend MUCH MORE TIME on this site...  with the majority of FDjakes post just personal attacks and straw men...  just look at their stats...  the overwhelming MAJORITY of FDjakes posts and time spent on this site are in Random Ramblings...   :rolleyes 

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: christopher w on June 09, 2009, 01:49:06 pm
Positive,

As a matter of fact I sold my last fully rehabbed investment property last may and made a nice profit of 30K thank you. I do however work with investors EVERY SINGLE DAY and give advice on structuring sales contracts, setting up HML loans, etc.... So if your point is to make me look as a if I am spouting about a subject in which I am not familiar you failed.

FdJake gives stock advice here which is where he is supposed to post.

FDJake has made his money already. Every month you hold the property in question your profit goes down. So while you can dream about the money you hope to make; he has already made his money and is using it to make more money. I am quite sure if we add up all of Jakes money made from that one deal as well as on the deals he had had since then from the profit it will be a nice tidy sum.

When Jake and I had a beef a few weeks back I did some very thorough digging on him and what I discovered is he is investing in Cars, and Vintage Guitars, and Stocks, and Real Estate so I am quite sure that he knows what he is talking about.

You on the other hand spend countless hours baiting people with your rhetoric and then nit-picking when they don't give you the EXACT answer you were looking for. Now who is childish? As I have said before arguing with you is like teaching a pig to dance. It never works and it just annoys the pig.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hoosier4life2005 on June 09, 2009, 01:56:15 pm
Looks like somebody thinks there better than you PostiveOutlook...... 

We get it Chris.. your awesome, and im a potsmoker, and PositiveOutlook is a childish lazy bum who sits on his PC spewing rhetoric.

We get it.  Your personal attacks are dead-on man.  Your posts are greatly appreciated.


Positive,

As a matter of fact I sold my last fully rehabbed investment property last may and made a nice profit of 30K thank you. I do however work with investors EVERY SINGLE DAY and give advice on structuring sales contracts, setting up HML loans, etc.... So if your point is to make me look as a if I am spouting about a subject in which I am not familiar you failed.

FdJake gives stock advice here which is where he is supposed to post.

FDJake has made his money already. Every month you hold the property in question your profit goes down. So while you can dream about the money you hope to make; he has already made his money and is using it to make more money. I am quite sure if we add up all of Jakes money made from that one deal as well as on the deals he had had since then from the profit it will be a nice tidy sum.

When Jake and I had a beef a few weeks back I did some very thorough digging on him and what I discovered is he is investing in Cars, and Vintage Guitars, and Stocks, and Real Estate so I am quite sure that he knows what he is talking about.

You on the other hand spend countless hours baiting people with your rhetoric and then nit-picking when they don't give you the EXACT answer you were looking for. Now who is childish? As I have said before arguing with you is like teaching a pig to dance. It never works and it just annoys the pig.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 02:01:56 pm
FDJake...

"He did NOTHING about slavery while President."

Again, you are incorrect and painting with your "broad strokes"... from my previous post - "He did not advocate the abolition of slavery while in office, but did sign legislation enforcing the prohibition of slavery in the Northwest Territory"

"What they DO, shows us how they REALLY lived their lives"

Which is why I did not just talk about real estate, I put my money where my mouth was an invested... how I proceed is my business...  It just so happens that in addition to the reasons I already provided, my son just got his learners permit, and wants to buy a car next year on his birthday, so he will be working with me this summer on finishing the project, so he can earn money for his car...   so again, I have personal reasons that you know nothing of, but are more than willing to criticize for...  Your opinion on how long I choose to work on this property has no effect on me personally, but it BORES everyone else, because just like your self-congratulation and insults, you do it ALL THE TIME...    :banghead


"made a nice profit of 30K thank you"

Christopher - GREAT!  Congratulations on your $30K!  How long did it take you?  I was not trying to make you "look as a if I am spouting about a subject in which I am not familiar you failed"...  I can read, and I know you are in mortgages and participate in Financing, Hard Money forum...

So there was no failure, as it was just an assumption on your part...  but you should know that according to FDJake's standards, you are not an investor...   :rolleyes

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: christopher w on June 09, 2009, 02:04:25 pm
I don't think I am better than anyone. That is what makes me the person I am and why I am so good at my job because I don't judge people. I give everyone the benefit of the doubt no matter how screwed up their belief system might be.

On the other hand you and all your right wing cronies on this board feel the need to bash everything that does not fit into the little black and white box in which you live.

For example... Gun control. I am all for the right to bear arms, but c'mon does anyone really need to own an assault rifle for personal protection??? If you are in a situation where you need an assault rifle to protect yourself you are in serious trouble.

I do however think I am smarter than most people. My posts are not personal attacks all I am doing is pointing out the facts as I see them.

But that is what liberals do correct? 
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hoosier4life2005 on June 09, 2009, 02:12:05 pm
Aside from strongly disagreeing with you on the gun control thing with the assault rifle...

You dont do personal attacks?  You call me a pot smoker(which isnt a fact, its an opinion, ive never said I have or not).  Not a fact.

My grammar is bad, who cares, its a message board.  My writing is understandable.  But yet, you still pick on that, but if you want, its fine.

And then.. theres the IU basketball thing... but lets not get into that.

I dont know if I would say I think im smarter than others, but I deffinetley believe for my age, I have a good outlook on what it takes to be successful in this world, and how thinks need to work. I believe my views are correct (as im sure you think yours are too)




I don't think I am better than anyone. That is what makes me the person I am and why I am so good at my job because I don't judge people. I give everyone the benefit of the doubt no matter how screwed up their belief system might be.

On the other hand you and all your right wing cronies on this board feel the need to bash everything that does not fit into the little black and white box in which you live.

For example... Gun control. I am all for the right to bear arms, but c'mon does anyone really need to own an assault rifle for personal protection??? If you are in a situation where you need an assault rifle to protect yourself you are in serious trouble.

I do however think I am smarter than most people. My posts are not personal attacks all I am doing is pointing out the facts as I see them.

But that is what liberals do correct? 
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 02:13:15 pm
Chris is not only an INVESTOR he's a REAL ESTATE INVESTOR!

A REAL ONE TOO!!

NOT a JOKE that runs his mouth about how WELL he did on a property that he hasn't FINISHED nevermind SOLD!!!!

What is ABSOLUTELY AMAZING about Positive is this......

He's ARGUING with a guy (ChrisW) who could give him INCREDIBLE INSIGHT into the next phase of his little TERMITE TURD....That is GETTING A BUYER FINANCED !!!!!

If this guy thinks getting this dump rehabbed was tough WAIT TILL HE SEE's how hard it will be to get it SOLD!!!

Chris does this for a LIVING.....He could be giving you PRICELESS advice about the financing process.

Wait till Positive see's how many WORTHLESS PRE-APPROVAL LETTERS are out there.

He's never done this before....He has NO IDEA what pitfalls are ahead of him.  The sales contracts alone can be a NIGHTMARE if you sign with the wrong person.

Again......A guy like CHRIS could be a HUGE asset to you.....BUT.... your EGO couldn't fit in the same room with another person.

You'll learn......EXACTLY the same way you learned how to PROPERLY inspect a house for TERMITES!!!

THE HARD WAY!!!!

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 02:14:48 pm
"Termite King AKA master of the cut and paste"

Christopher, the cut and paste of quotes is done for your's and others benefit, as most do not read history books...  the dumbing down of our children in public education on their country's history and heritage is horrific...

I am interested in history, which is WHY you will find me challenging falsehoods...  I am more interested in the history of subjects rather than who comes out looking good...

But again, your assertion of "Termite King" or "Loosier4life" instead of his actual screen name Hoosier4life2005 as an insult does NOTHING to add to the conversation and make YOU look bad, and just making the point that when liberals are out of substance or can't adequately defend their positions, they insult...

...just shows weakness, not strength...

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 02:18:02 pm
Well I'm glad you're more interested in the history of a subject  than who comes out looking good!!!!  Because YOU AIN'T LOOKING GOOD HERE PAL!!!

and......NO.....

WEAKNESS should be your middle name Positive.

I have NEVER seen a person with as little experience as you have GLOAT about his SUCCESS on a project you have YET to even COMPLETE.

MIND BOGGLING!!!!

Borderline DELUSIONAL!!!!
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hoosier4life2005 on June 09, 2009, 02:21:19 pm

Postive, you have to understand.....

If people read history books, they would realize that Socialism hasnt worked throughout history.  But then, Liberals wouldnt know what to do, so ....... they just ignore all of history and have fun with personal attacks and coming up with policies that make them feel good inside.  Alot like Chris!

Also, the answer Liberals give to the failing public school situation is to THROW MORE MONEY AT IT.  Chris.... im a perfect example of the outcome from 12 years of public schooling, and you yourself know how bad my grammer is.  Please tell your liberal buddies to stop the taxes and dont give public schools more money okay?

My opinion is pretty much nothing on this board, and I realize that.  Ive never made a penny yet, so spare me FDJAKE(even tho i do find your posts helpful)


"Termite King AKA master of the cut and paste"

Christopher, the cut and paste of quotes is done for your's and others benefit, as most do not read history books...  the dumbing down of our children in public education on their country's history and heritage is horrific...

I am interested in history, which is WHY you will find me challenging falsehoods...  I am more interested in the history of subjects rather than who comes out looking good...

But again, your assertion of "Termite King" or "Loosier4life" instead of his actual screen name Hoosier4life2005 as an insult does NOTHING to add to the conversation and make YOU look bad, and just making the point that when liberals are out of substance or can't adequately defend their positions, they insult...

...just shows weakness, not strength...


Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 02:24:12 pm
Well if there's anyone here who would know about history books it's an 18 year old kid right out of HIGH SCHOOL who talks about investments like he's Jimmy Rodgers.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hoosier4life2005 on June 09, 2009, 02:26:40 pm
Im not even intelligent enough to understand that insult (dont know who jimmy rodgers is, aside from being a musician) so... yeah. Keep throwin money at the system guys!(Public schools baby!!!) Itll work eventually!!!!



Well if there's anyone here who would know about history books it's an 18 year old kid right out of HIGH SCHOOL who talks about investments like he's Jimmy Rodgers.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 02:30:49 pm
Ya know what Hoosier?????

I think I can work with you......You haven't gone to the darkside yet.

Don't buy into all the right wing BULLSH*T  Kid.......  You've got an entire LIFE ahead of you.  KEEP THAT MIND OPEN!!!!

It CAN be BOTH ways......You can help people AND make a PILE of MONEY all at the same time. 

And I could care less if you smoke pot or don't smoke pot.....I did when I was your age.  It didn't lead me to ANYTHING...Just like having a BEER didn't turn me into a raging alcoholic.

Your reply earned you a LOT of points in my book!!  And I'm serious.
 :beer :beer :beer :beer
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: christopher w on June 09, 2009, 02:31:38 pm
Loosier,

Now your attacking public schools?? That is the saddest thing read here all day. Think about all the teachers you have had in your 12+ years of school, and I say 12+ because I am sure you repeated a grade or two. All the hard work that all of the people at your schools put in to make you into the obvious know it all teenage punk you are today and you can sit there and bash them like that. Dude, if I was in Indiana right now I would drive to your trailer house drag you outside and kick the crap out of you.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 02:32:56 pm
"If this guy thinks getting this dump rehabbed was tough"

Actually I don't find the rehab tough at all... I'm sure selling it will be tougher, though... 

"The sales contracts alone can be a NIGHTMARE if you sign with the wrong person."

When I first started, I hooked up with a realtor, who helped me with things like COMPS, etc... and I agreed to work with him selling the property... We put together an agreement based on performance...  4% for the first month, 3% for the second and 1.5% for the third, and if he does not show it a minimum of 5 times a month (should have said 10), the agreement can be dissolved...  He has a great track record, and own his own Help-U-Sell, and his DOM averages are between 30-45 days...  so for this first flip, I'll honor my committment to him... going forward, I'll be looking at other avenues if that doesn't work out...



"EXACTLY the same way you learned how to PROPERLY inspect a house for TERMITES"

Both a city inspector and a certified inspector did not catch this...  but the great FDjake  would have, and I have an ego....   :rolleyes  It was in a relatively small area BEHIND crap under the house AND gerry-rigged posts...

If I can't rely on a city inspector with a report on the property AND a certified inspector they REQUIRED, I certainly can't rely on them when I go to sell...   :rolleyes 

Christopher, as a course of business, I'm sure can tell you, that he relies on a certified inspectors report from all over the country, right?  I guess they are all not reliable if mistakes are made...  and they ARE made, correct Christopher?

People DO make mistakes, FDjake...  Normal people don't relive it over and over again, unless they have an agenda... which is WHY I believe it just bolsters the argument that it is KILLING YOU that the rookie's numbers were BETTER than the self-proclaimed FDJAke...   :rolleyes


Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hoosier4life2005 on June 09, 2009, 02:36:45 pm
Wow, just ... wow.  Of the whole 12 years I were in school, I can honestly say there were maybe 3-4 good teachers I had the whole time.  I couldve learned more reading books from a library than spending 7 hours a day in that hellhole they call public schooling.  Math was the only subject that school helped me in at all.  Keep throwing money at it though man, itll fix eventually, im sure.

I have little respect for teachers(the majority) that are a complete joke, and would be FIRED in the private sector in a HEARTBEAT due to their poor performance.

I went to a typical HS, not a bottom-of-the-line HS either.

And now you assult me by calling me trailer trash?  I dont live in a trailer, but even if I did, theres nothing wrong with that.  You freakin Liberal Elitest.





Loosier,

Now your attacking public schools?? That is the saddest thing read here all day. Think about all the teachers you have had in your 12+ years of school, and I say 12+ because I am sure you repeated a grade or two. All the hard work that all of the people at your schools put in to make you into the obvious know it all teenage punk you are today and you can sit there and bash them like that. Dude, if I was in Indiana right now I would drive to your trailer house drag you outside and kick the crap out of you.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hooch on June 09, 2009, 02:37:12 pm
That is what makes me the person I am and why I am so good at my job because I don't judge people.


LOL, I can't believe that is comming out of your mouth Christopher.

your right wing cronies on this board feel the need to bash everything that does not fit into the little black and white box in which you live.

The king of bashing has officially found people who he thinks bash more than him.

For example... Gun control. I am all for the right to bear arms, but c'mon does anyone really need to own an assault rifle for personal protection??? If you are in a situation where you need an assault rifle to protect yourself you are in serious trouble.

There is a reason why but you have never read the constitution therefore will never know that reason.

I do however think I am smarter than most people.

How can you call liberal economics smart?

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 02:38:03 pm
"I have NEVER seen a person with as little experience as you have GLOAT about his SUCCESS on a project you have YET to even COMPLETE"

Gloat... no, just stating the facts... I wouldn't even be bringing it up if you weren't constantly using it a DISTRACTION with regards to the topics at hand...  Think about it FDJake... the only time it comes up, is when YOU bring it up...  but, I am "gloating"...

I just recently started pointing out within the past WEEK when I posted the numbers that you are just upset the rookie's numbers are better than yours...   :biggrin   which is WHY you try to demean it so often...

Are you now disagreeing with all other investors on the concept that you make your money going in?
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 02:42:20 pm
You HAVEN'T MADE A DIME........NOT A CENT...

And you have NO IDEA what is waiting for you out there.  Do you REALLY think your little performance based contract is going to dig out those WORTHLESS pre-approvals??????

IT'S NOT!!!!!!

And when you SIGN with a person that has a weak pre-approval YOU"LL LEARN YOUR NEXT LESSON.

Chris W could help you avert this common NEW GUY mistake.

But you KNOW EVERYTHING!!!

You haven't even finished HALF this project.  Never mind doing BETTER than another person.

WAIT......You have a TON to learn about how things REALLY work out there....

You COMPLETELY missed what I was talking about....You have NO CLUE how to dig these worthless pre-approvals out....and now adays you WILL be presented with NUMEROUS versions. 

Like I said.......You'lll LEARN........The HARD WAY!!!
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hoosier4life2005 on June 09, 2009, 02:44:07 pm
You better beware fdjake.... Chris is going to criticize you for not using grammatically correct english on the word "ya" and... you smoked pot?!?!?!?  Wow... cant wait to see Chris's reaction to that... your a pothead loser now, you know that?



Ya know what Hoosier?????

I think I can work with you......You haven't gone to the darkside yet.

Don't buy into all the right wing BULLSH*T  Kid.......  You've got an entire LIFE ahead of you.  KEEP THAT MIND OPEN!!!!

It CAN be BOTH ways......You can help people AND make a PILE of MONEY all at the same time. 

And I could care less if you smoke pot or don't smoke pot.....I did when I was your age.  It didn't lead me to ANYTHING...Just like having a BEER didn't turn me into a raging alcoholic.

Your reply earned you a LOT of points in my book!!  And I'm serious.
 :beer :beer :beer :beer
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 02:45:14 pm
"because I don't judge people"

No, just call 'em "Loosier" and "potsmoker" and "termite king" etc., etc. etc....

but you don't "judge people"... Christopher, like FDjake, you are much more intelligent (even if self-proclaimed by the both of you) than this... why the insults?

Can you not provide discourse WITHOUT directly insulting people?  Is that something you would teach your kids?  Don't discuss the idea's but ridicule people personally who disagree with you?  It's one thing to disagree or ridicule an idea, but it quite another to get personal... to just degrade the respect people may have for you and your opinion...
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 02:49:11 pm
Hoosier...

Get your head out of your @SS.

I can GUARANTEE YOU that you can learn a HELL of a lot more about Real Estate investing from Chris than you can from Positive.  Chris is in the mortgage business, he can give you advice that at your AGE can set you up for success.  This business LIVES on YOUR ability to BORROW money.  And you're arguing with a guy that does this for a LIVING.  Send him a PM and patch this BS up.  It'll be the best move you made here all year.  Then LISTEN TO HIM and DO what he tells you to do. 

Who gives ash*T what political party this guy belongs to or if he said you smoked pot???.....LEARN from someone who can TEACH you something.

If I was 18 an a successful investor decided to teach me he could call me a drunk and I'd be fine with it. 

CUT the BULLSH*T....You're a KID with a TON to learn.  Lose the attitude and start PAYING ATTENTION.

You have MILLIONAIRES HERE who can teach you....But they're not going to waste their time on a know it all 18 year old kid.

Don't blow it before you even get it started

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hoosier4life2005 on June 09, 2009, 02:57:05 pm
When somebody calls me a potsmoker, says that I live in a trailer(nothing wrong with that), and refers to me as loosier just because of a view I have, its somewhat hard to listen to somebody like that, when that person constantly just bashes people.

When I simply said.. im more interested in trading stocks than I was in REI, he quickly bashes me, and demands that I offer my stock predictions. and I bet if i hadnt made enough, or im not as informed in the stock market as you are Jake, in the stock market (even though im 18, im sure it wouldnt matter to Chris) I would have gotten bashed for that too.

Chris doesnt seem very willing to offer his knowledge(im sure he has some, hes making $$ apparently) and is more interested in just bashing..




Hoosier...

Get your head out of your @SS.

I can GUARANTEE YOU that you can learn a HELL of a lot more about Real Estate investing from Chris than you can from Positive.

Who gives ash*T what political party this guy belongs to.....LEARN from someone who can TEACH you something.

CUT the BULLSH*T....You're a KID with a TON to learn.  Lose the attitude and start PAYING ATTENTION.

You have MILLIONAIRES HERE who can teach you....But they're not going to waste their time on a know it all 18 year old kid.

Don't blow it before you even get it started.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 03:05:56 pm
Hoosier,

You pissed him off....

Do you want to argue or MAKE MONEY?????

If a millionaire (and I'm not saying Chris is a millionaire) said something that made you mad, would you NOT listen to him if he could help you????

Get use to it Kid.......This is what LIFE is about.  Dealing with people you may not like to obtain a goal you WANT!!!!

Chris is SOLID and the info he can give you is PRICELESS at your age.

What possible REASON would I have to give you this advice other than to help you???

Mike Rossi (property manager) and I have had our go rounds...But I can tell you that if I needed advice on a rental....HE's the guy I'm talking to.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 03:07:14 pm
"You HAVEN'T MADE A DIME........NOT A CENT..."

So AGAIN, since you didn't answer it AGAIN... are you saying that you now disagree with other investors here and elsewhere that the concept of making your money going in is not applicable?


"And you have NO IDEA what is waiting for you out there."

That's true, I have not sold an investment property before, which is WHY I will be watching and learning...

"Do you REALLY think your little performance based contract is going to dig out those WORTHLESS pre-approvals??????"

No, but it frontloads the performance regarding activity on my property...  and in this case, being that I am honoring my committment to the realtor, we'll see how it works out when I put it up for sale...

"And when you SIGN with a person that has a weak pre-approval YOU"LL LEARN YOUR NEXT LESSON."

That is something that is out of my control... worst case scenario, I can rent it out or lease-option it...  but BECAUSE I took my time, paid for it, I have OPTIONS....


"Chris W could help you avert this common NEW GUY mistake." -

No doubt about it, Christopher is a smart guy (even self-proclaimed), but the more he sounds and operates like you (not idea's, but insults), the less I am interested in hearing his opinion...  I feel everyone has much more to learn on this site from the likes of PropertyManager, Hooch, who spend their time providing relevant idea's WITHOUT insulting everyone...  I am sure the owners of this site appreciate all your insightful insults and abuse, FDjake...  You have much more to contribute than the way you do it now...

"But you KNOW EVERYTHING!!!"

FDjake, you are the only one who asserts this... I have said on MULTIPLE occassions that I do not know everything... as a matter of fact, you find me saying this more in posts than you, so who is saying they "know it all"...  you couldn't even say based on the number that was a great pick on the property I chose... what does that say about who you are?


"You haven't even finished HALF this project."

Another assumption on your part... 



"You have a TON to learn about how things REALLY work out there...."

Maybe, but I am not afraid to admit it...


"Like I said.......You'lll LEARN........The HARD WAY!!!"

That which doesn't kill us makes us stronger...  sometimes the BEST LESSONS are learned the hard way... but it shouldn't matter to you... you have no real interest in my success, and that is quite obvious...
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 03:08:18 pm
FDjake... are you a cash millionaire or a paper millionaire?...
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 03:15:29 pm
"I can GUARANTEE YOU that you can learn a HELL of a lot more about Real Estate investing from Chris than you can from Positive. "

Yes, Hoosier4life2005, you can learn alot more about real estate funding strategies from Christopher...   

But as far as real estate investing goes, he is one more house ahead of me, so I would rely on people who have ALOT more experience than both of us when it comes to the strategies of flipping or renting of houses...

"If a millionaire (and I'm not saying Chris is a millionaire) said something that made you mad, would you NOT listen to him if he could help you????"

There are other millionaires here who can give you the same advice sans the insults...  you can follow whomever you feel comfortable... 
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: christopher w on June 09, 2009, 03:16:01 pm
Does it really matter?

Is Bill Gates a paper BILLIONAIRE or a cash BILLIONAIRE?

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 03:17:08 pm
Positive...

Let me put this to you simply....

I think you are completely full of YOURSELF and full of sh*T.  I also think you're a LIAR. You CONTINUE to claim you made money on a house that has yet to be FINISHED or SOLD....  That's BULLSH*T where I come from.   And I have absolutely no desire to hear your theories on ANY subject.

And NO.......Signing a P$S with a LOSER is COMPLETELY in your controll....BUT YOU KNOW EVERYTHING because you sold a property before!!!  Chris could show you a VERY SIMPLE clause to put in your P&S that ENSURES the potential buyer is FOR REAL.  The fact that you never even TOUCHED on this SHOWS us ALL you have NO IDEA what that clause is.  But .....You know it all....

GREAT...Glad to hear it.....NOW go finish your PROJECT....Then you can tell us in APRIL of 2010 IF it sells how much you made.

And as long as that project is NOT FINISHED you aren't even HALF way there....  The SALE is the OTHER half of this investment.  But you'd have to KNOW what you were doing to understand that concept.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hooch on June 09, 2009, 03:18:45 pm
Hoosier, No worries. There are many more millionaires here that share your politics than that don't.

Besides the fact, I would be shocked if he actually withheld information from you just because you have a different world view. But it wouldn't matter if he did because like I said, there are many experienced investors here that can tell you what you need to know.

I would never a** kiss to a lib anyways.



Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hooch on June 09, 2009, 03:20:30 pm
No worries Positive, I will teach you how a worthless buyer will make you more money than one with cash. FD knows what I am suggesting.



Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 03:22:14 pm
Hoosier.....

DON'T DRINK THE KOOL AIDE KID!!!

Those righties LOVE that KOOL AIDE!!
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 03:23:08 pm
Christopher...

"I also think you're a LIAR"

Show us the post where I lied, and BTW use my words not your assumptions...

Otherwise, you'll sound like FDjake's hollow and unfounded attack... if you are going to try and attack my integrity....  PROVE IT, don't just say it.... otherwise, without the PROOF, you are making a FALSE accusation...

"Is Bill Gates a paper BILLIONAIRE or a cash BILLIONAIRE"

Actually, Bill Gates is a cash Billionaire...
Title: Re: I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: christopher w on June 09, 2009, 03:24:00 pm
New USATODAY.com headline

Poll Shows Grumpy GOP.


WASHINGTON — In thinking about the Republican Party's troubles, consider this: One-third of Republicans now say they have an unfavorable opinion of their party.
There's no such dyspepsia among Democrats. Just 4% have an unfavorable view of their party.

The findings of a USA TODAY/Gallup Poll underscore the perilous state of the GOP. Over the past three years, Republicans have lost control of the White House, the House of Representatives and the Senate, and they're now struggling to forge a unified response to the popular new Democratic president.

A third of the people in your own party think YOU SUCK. How funny is that. No wonder all of your right wing nuts are so unhappy. It will take years to get the stink of W. of off your skin. :bobble
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: fdjake on June 09, 2009, 03:26:15 pm
CHRIS......

I'm financing my next 3 properties through YOU!!!!
 :beer
That made my DAY!!!!

The only down side is the 15 pages of quotes, graphs, historic outlines, and opinion we'll get from Positive now.

And the PROOF of Positives LIES are right in his posts when asked how his project turned out.  He REPEATEDLY said he made money on it.  Only when pressed on the details did he come clean and ADMIT he never even FINISHED the project.  He STILL says he made money on it. :bs :bs :bs :bs
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hooch on June 09, 2009, 03:28:15 pm
You would know the real reason for this Chris if you actually understood both sides of the political spectrum rather than going to USA Today for your information.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 03:32:30 pm
"people in your own party"

LOL... Christopher, you are a moderator here, and you don't know that I have voted for Dems, Rep's, AND Ind...  I am a consertative, and Bush was MUCH better choice than Gore OR Kerry...  during the same election last year, I also voted for a DEM candidate who aligned with my position of LESS GOVERNMENT as opposed to more...

What may be confusing you is that I am defending the opposite of Obama, which you ASSUME is only republican...  If the Rep party goes back to their conservatve princples, I will gravitate back to them as a party on the national level... 

There's a little button at the top of the page called "search", and you can use it look up what the actual users say...

LOL...  :rolleyes
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: christopher w on June 09, 2009, 03:33:17 pm
Poor stinky Hooch. Turns out 1/3 of his friends don't like him. Haha this is actually turning into a hilarious discussion.

Please don't post another youtube video disputing this poll. Haha.

Perhaps you could send me some information on the Bilderburg Group though.  :bs
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 03:34:20 pm
"I'm financing my next 3 properties through YOU!!!!"

Hold 'em to it, Christopher!


"Poor stinky Hooch. Turns out 1/3 of his friends don't like him"

But you don't "judge" people...   :rolleyes
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: christopher w on June 09, 2009, 03:42:23 pm
I wasn't judging him. As I said the stink of W. will haunt the GOP for a long time. I have no doubt that many of the GOP will be distancing themselves from him in the next election and he will have been long gone by then. It doesn't help that Cheney is finally coming out of his "Undisclosed Location" trying to get back into the spotlight.

 

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: PositiveOutlook on June 09, 2009, 03:47:13 pm
"I wasn't judging him."

Yes, just insulting him... SO much better...  :rolleyes
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hoosier4life2005 on June 09, 2009, 03:49:39 pm
:) These conversations are so funny.


"I wasn't judging him."

Yes, just insulting him... SO much better...  :rolleyes
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: christopher w on June 09, 2009, 03:57:52 pm
I am sorry, but if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck then I have to call it a duck.

Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hooch on June 09, 2009, 04:10:46 pm
You don't hear me calling you a turd bugler but as you say if it walks like a duck, acts like a duck than it's a duck than I guess you are.



Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: christopher w on June 09, 2009, 04:17:25 pm
I am not familiar with the term "Turd Bugler".

Perhaps you could post a link to a youtube video to show it to me. Haha.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hooch on June 09, 2009, 04:20:47 pm
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=1317761
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: christopher w on June 09, 2009, 04:22:58 pm
Sorry, I avoid myspace. Too many Pedophiles. No offense though. To each his own.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hooch on June 09, 2009, 04:26:45 pm
Just click the link, it's funny. I got it off google videos but if I didn't click where I got it from you would have a bunch of them rather than one.

Ok, you can watch it here if you are scared that you will be attacked by a pedophile.

http://video.google.com/videosearch?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&hs=PC9&ei=fNMuSpjwB6S0Na6DvP0J&resnum=0&q=turd%20burglar&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wv#
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hoosier4life2005 on June 09, 2009, 04:28:01 pm
Look at my sig.  My myspace is awesome.



Sorry, I avoid myspace. Too many Pedophiles. No offense though. To each his own.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hooch on June 09, 2009, 04:38:33 pm
What is this amazing dancer video? Is that you?  LOL. It's pretty funny.

I like that Ron Paul video below it. It was designed nicely and some good solid messages.
Title: Re: Just another reason why I cant stand Liberal lefties
Post by: Hoosier4life2005 on June 09, 2009, 04:51:48 pm
Yeah im the bald guy with the sunglasses. Its nice right?

and yeah, Ron Paul baby!



What is this amazing dancer video? Is that you?  LOL. It's pretty funny.

I like that Ron Paul video below it. It was designed nicely and some good solid messages.