Real Estate Investing Forums

Real Estate Investing => Bird Dogs, Wholesaling => Topic started by: Lamar on August 31, 2007, 10:39:09 pm

Title: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on August 31, 2007, 10:39:09 pm
The purpose of this posting is to give you Birddogs (Property Locator sounds better) a little help in getting started in the birddog world. I just want to outline your responsibilities as a birddog and how to avoid pitfalls, which may discourage your efforts.

STEP 1. Find an Investor to Birddog for.
         
          -You can find investors anywhere. ReiClub is a great start. Look at the Investor Ads for your state and find out if that Investor gives out referral/finder fees for properties that you locate for them

           - You can always advertise your services in the REICLUB Classified Ad Section.

           - Use websites like craigslist.com, backpage.com, kaboo.org, etc. One thing you will learn in the Real Estate world is that MARKETING is what drives the biz. No matter if your a birddog, or an investor.


STEP 2. Identify your Investor's Criteria

           - Ask them what areas they need properties in. If they say Nationwide, then you hit the jackpot because you can look anywhere.

           - Ask them what ARV (After Repair Value) or LTV (Loan to Value) they purchase at minus the repair costs. 

               Here's an example: Let's say a property is worth $100,000 and needs $0.00 in Repairs. The investor tells you that they purchase at 70% ARV - rehab costs.

     How much should the seller's asking price be? Your answer $70,000

     [$100,000 (Home Value) X 70% ARV - 0.00 repairs= $70,000.

Therefore your investor will most likely not purchase this home for more than $70,000. If the seller is asking for more, Ask them if they'll consider less. If they say No, Move onto the next one. If they say Yes, contact your investor ASAP. If they say maybe, Contact your Investor ASAP. Unless you are really skilled at negotiating, let the seller know that you'll get in touch with your investor and he/she will be handling the negotiating offer, once you submit the deal to them.

STEP 3: GET IT IN WRITING.

          -This is a good way to do business, but if you can't get it in writing, then so be it. You can still do business with the Investor. Don't let that hold you back. BUT with that said, when you become an INVESTOR, everything you do should be in writing. IT BETTER BE!! LOL


Step 4. Give your Investor as much INFO upfront as possible.

          - The less info you provide, the slower the deal will probably go, because You'll be busy playing the messenger. Everytime Your Investor asks you a question, you have to run back to the seller, then you take the seller's answer and run back to the Investor to give them that. This can go on for days, before your Investor even contacts the Seller. DON'T WASTE TIME. Here's what they will most likely be looking for and forgive me if I miss anything, but you can always ask Your INVESTOR ANYWAY:


          1. Asking Price
          2. Property Value
          3. Repair Costs
          4. Repair details
          5. Mortgage Balance (If applicable)
          6. Mortgage Payments (If applicable)
          7. Reason Why the seller is Selling!
          8. Comparables
          9. PHOTOS
          10. Full Address and contact INFO of Owner

Now, I listed 10 things that are necessary for Investors to make decisions. There are much more thing's they'll need, but what I listed above should keep the questions to a minimum. If anything the 1st 6 steps to include the Photos is definitely a MUST Give. Investors want the NUMBERS and PICTURES. Just Numbers will do for some of them. That is what will make them look at your deal.

Step 5. Always keep the Contact Info of the seller and the Investor.

          -If you do not hear from your investor. Follow up with them. If they can't be reached, follow up with the seller. Sometimes Investors get so busy that they may forget to update you on the status.

          -Another thing is, if the Investor tries to go around you and cut you out the deal, then you can just follow up with the seller to find out what the status is. This is a rare situation, but it can happen this day and age. In this situation, you can let the Investor know that because he closed on the deal, he needs to pay you what was agreed to. If he ignores you, then simply move on. It would probably be less cost effective for you in the long run if you avoid courts, etc. NEVER DEAL WTH THAT INVESTOR AGAIN!! Yes, it is true that you lost out on a deal and the investor made money because of you, BUT with that said, they won't be making any more money off of you.

Ok Enough of the Negative side to this. Let's move on to the next step.


Step 6: When your Investor has the deal under contract, help him MARKET it. Many birddogs just rely on the Investor to market the deal and they just sit around waiting to get paid.

          -Check this out, if you find a buyer for the property then you have basically coordinated the entire thing and you should get paid as soon as they close. I say should, because you know what we discussed in STEP 5.

          - Another reason you want to find a buyer, is because some investors offer Double Bonuses!! They'll pay you for finding the the Property and finding the Buyer!!! Ask your Investor about that....They may do it, or they may not. Don't let it discourage you though.

          - Not only can finding a buyer for your Investor make you money, but if you just happen to find another Investor who's interested in the deal, then you just found another Investor that you can BIRDDOG for.

          - Now Occasionally you'll get people who will respond to your ad about your Investor's property and they want to see the property, or they just want to inquire about it. Then they decide it's not for them. So what do you do.....Forget about them, right? WRONG!!!!!! You keep their contact information and start building a Buyer's LIST. These are for those future properties that you'll be finding, that just may spark their interest! Grow your list by MARKETING, MARKETING, MARKETING. Eventually when you move up to the investor stage, you'll have a Buyer's LIST of your own!! Make Sense???


STEP 7. GETTING PAID!!!!!

        -Absolutely, this is the best part right? When your Investor Closes on the deal, you get PAID anywhere between $500 -$1000 per deal. If you find 5 deals a month that your Investor closes on, you could be making an extra $5000 a month that your investor.  Sometimes you can even make more. It all depends on your investor. These are just average figures

       -NOTE: You may have to wait 2-6 weeks to get paid. It all depends on the buyer. If they are a cash buyer, you should get paid within 2 weeks. If it's a buyer that is looking to close on a conventional loan or something, then you will be waiting a lot longer. But whether it is a cash buyer or a conventional buyer, you NEED TO FIND A BUYER PERIOD!! Income is Income no matter how you look at it. Patience is a Virtue!

          - Set up a PayPal account, if you'd like. You'll get paid Instantly when Your Investor closes. Instead of having to wait for the mail. But hey, Income is income, right?




Well, that's all I can think of. I'm tired and I need to get the bed. I hope this will help you get started. Don't be a BIRDDOG Forever. Move up Quickly! You can Do it. You'll find that the biggest struggle that everone has when getting started in Real Estate is themselves!!



INVESTORS PLEASE LET ME KNOW IF I MISSED ANYTHING!!

Disclaimer: This is based on my personal opinion/experience. Proceed at your own risk!
Title: Re: ATTN: BIRDDOGS
Post by: fadi on September 01, 2007, 09:07:20 am
Great post. I would like to add a comment though... Many investors look at bird dogging at a bad thing or as letting too much money get away from them. This is really not the case and everyone including the experienced investors will bird dog from time to time.

I have list of other investors who I will send them the leads I do not want to pursue. If they take them and close on them, they send me a referal fee.

I believe in a 3 step system:

1. Birddog the deals you cannot wholesale
2. Wholesale the deals you cannot do yourself
3. Do the deals you can do

The word "cannot" does not mean the deal is not profitable. You may not be able to do it due to knowledge, risk, time, or money.
Title: Re: ATTN: BIRDDOGS
Post by: Lamar on September 01, 2007, 11:36:07 am
Excellent point Fadi. You don't want to just do birddoging and leave it at that. Mix it up when you can. It just makes that much sense.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: ericmedem on September 11, 2007, 08:13:25 am
Great post, just out of curiosity how much money have you made using these strategies? 
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on September 11, 2007, 01:32:49 pm
That's a bit personal, but trust me I made enough to back up what I'm saying. LOL

It all comes down to consistency and  good follow up!
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Bexo on September 14, 2007, 06:47:49 am
This thread should be made a sticky to avoid the inevitable request for information about birddogging that is coming in about 2 weeks, and then againg 2 weeks after that, and again.....
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on September 16, 2007, 03:31:36 pm
Tell me about it. LOL :rolleyes
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Hoosier4life2005 on October 03, 2007, 05:44:00 pm
And how do you find the deals after you have investors that will let u birddog for them?

I have a few investors, and I know what they are looking for , but I dont know where exactly do look.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: timandlisa1208 on October 11, 2007, 02:34:53 pm
great post lots of good info
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: scostell on October 12, 2007, 11:59:08 am
And how do you find the deals after you have investors that will let u birddog for them?

I have a few investors, and I know what they are looking for , but I dont know where exactly do look.

Take this answer for what it's worth, as it is from someone who is new to REI but has read ALOT! 

You'll need to
-look for Foreclosures and preforeclosers
-Drive the neighborhoods
-go to open houses
-Post signs
-Send letters
-tell everyone you know you are looking for houses to buy
-news papers
-craigslist

I'm sure there are more ways, these are just the ones I can think of off the top of my head.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on October 30, 2007, 09:20:50 pm
And how do you find the deals after you have investors that will let u birddog for them?

I have a few investors, and I know what they are looking for , but I dont know where exactly do look.

Looks like I missed this one, but what Scostell said is correct. Another place to find deals is through other Investors (Networking!). Other Investors (Such as myself, "hint hint") are looking to sell their deals for profit and they wouldn't mind birddogs helping them sell their property buy finding a buyer.

Think about it. The Investor you are woking with is looking for a property. What if you found another Investor who had a great deal. You could just put the two together and get paid twice!!

Just a little Insider Birddog Secret, if you will.  :beer
Title: When working with an agent....get your fee agreement in place 1st w/Investor!!!
Post by: HomeLocator on November 01, 2007, 09:52:32 pm
As an agent (free service to investors as the seller's agent pays our fees), we get investors attempting to go around the bird dogs and go directly to us.  If you're using us to find the 50%-70% ARV's for your investors with comps, etc., make sure you have your fee agreement in place FIRST.  A lot of title companies will not allow for bird dog fees, so make sure you're protected up front with a separate agreement!

Agents love bird dogs, but as you're not licensed, we are not allowed to give you commissions.  Since you are not a principal, we are not allowed to give you money back.

So use us, we know what we're doing, but protect yourself BEFORE you introduce us to the investor.....you'd be amazed how many investors come to us begging for deals behind your backs!!!!   Non-circumvent and/or fee agreement for your finds (agent's finds) signed FIRST!!!

Hope it helps...........Linda
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on November 02, 2007, 09:09:27 am
As an agent (free service to investors as the seller's agent pays our fees), we get investors attempting to go around the bird dogs and go directly to us.  If you're using us to find the 50%-70% ARV's for your investors with comps, etc., make sure you have your fee agreement in place FIRST.  A lot of title companies will not allow for bird dog fees, so make sure you're protected up front with a separate agreement!

Agents love bird dogs, but as you're not licensed, we are not allowed to give you commissions.  Since you are not a principal, we are not allowed to give you money back.

So use us, we know what we're doing, but protect yourself BEFORE you introduce us to the investor.....you'd be amazed how many investors come to us begging for deals behind your backs!!!!   Non-circumvent and/or fee agreement for your finds (agent's finds) signed FIRST!!!

Hope it helps...........Linda


Good Point Linda! With that said, there are a lot of Investors that bypass properties that are listed and go straight to the FSBO seller. Again, if you can get an agreement, but if you can't then, go with your gut feeling!  Don't let anything slow down your momentum!
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: BRITT REED on December 22, 2007, 02:25:28 am
thanks for the info....
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: tvaldez on December 23, 2007, 03:55:27 pm
So where is the line between birddog and wholesaler. It seems to me that the difference is creating the purchase contract along with the assignment agreement would be the only difference. Am I wrong?????
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: fadi on December 23, 2007, 04:45:22 pm
Ability to negotiate and structure a good deal, ability to correctly evaluate the deal, ability to get rid of the deal..etc.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: tvaldez on December 23, 2007, 07:44:21 pm
Right Fadi, wouldn't the list of items lamar gave PLUS a contract and assignment make it more then a birddog deal? Please don't take my reply other then an inquiry to learn more. I have been researching to do a couple of side wholesale deals and this very topic is by biggest concern. I mean if I were to put together a great deal and hand it over to a buyer(already lined up and meeting their requirements) wouldn't it be in my best interest to seek more money from the deal since I did find it, negotiated it, packaged it then delivered it to the buyer? I just know from experience that i's fine to do a lot of legwork, but getting paid from a buyer is another thing. Once performance has been done, a buyer somehow FORGETS the value you brought them and wants to renegotiate your fee. Maybe I'm over thinking it.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: fadi on December 23, 2007, 07:55:55 pm
Absolutely. If you know how to do all that, and can wholesale it, then by all means do.

I see birddogging important in couple of situations:

1. You are new, you do not know the ropes yet, you may want to birddog deals you can't do to make some money and learn in the process.
2. You find a deal that does not fit the rehab or landlord requirement, you may birddog it to sub2 buyer.


For example, a wholesaler I know got a bite on her marketing. The house was an expired listing that did not sell at $122k. Seller owed $108k. Just about every wholesaler I know would usually walk away from such deal since there was not enough equity in it. Knowing what I do, she called me. I bought it at $108k, gave her $1000 referral fee, and making about $36k profit on this deal.

For her, it was a dead lead. For me, it was a great deal. She made money where someone else would have walked away.


I hope this makes sense.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: tvaldez on December 24, 2007, 12:11:17 pm
WOW Fadi, thanks! That's exactly my mindset in lining up my buyers. Each one has their own criteria and buying goals which will allow me to find a seller then offer it to the right buyer. "One man's trash is another man's treasure".

I've been mortgage loan officer for the past 4 years which has allowed me  to analyze a homeowners variables and to quickly assess their situation. That along with my carpenter experience to evaluate the physical property should enable me to put together some really good deals!

Thanks for the confidence and happy holidays.....
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Freevoice on December 25, 2007, 04:54:38 am
@Lamar,

Do you have a sample Bird-dog to Investor agreement?
I need this for a commercial real estate investor...Thx!
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: DeeinAustin on December 25, 2007, 08:16:17 pm
The easiest way to spot a wholesaler who SHOULD be a bird dog is how strong the contract is. We've had some horrible contracts assigned to us, but they were good deals and it didn't matter.

I can tell strong investors by how well the contract is written because it has a good option (no less than 14 days, which is tough unless it's a great deal), fair earnest (but not too much, let's say .05%), etc. You don't have to fleece the seller, but we've had deals with 5-7 day options and 2% earnest. We knew we were going to close even though we only had 1-2 days for due diligence.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: tvaldez on December 25, 2007, 10:11:32 pm
Hi, so based on everything you've told me, what should I LOOk for in an investor? I have one now who wants to buy low ARV properties, no more then 10K in repairs with a few other requirements. I plan on calling some of the ads I've seen(craigslist, backpage, bandit signs, penny pincher,etc..). What would be some telltale signs of a good/bad investor?????
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: nrinvestor867 on December 27, 2007, 10:50:15 pm
I don't usually post but I have been a member of REIclub for the last few years.And I could not resist this one.

I just wanted to point out that in this industry it dosen't take long to make a name for yourself , be it good or bad, especialy if you work in one specific area.My target area is Sacramento Ca. And I have gotten to know a lot  of the areas best and worst investors here.

Your career as an Investor or Birddog will either take off or die depending on how you conduct business.

I treat my Birddogs extremely well , because without them as part of my team I would not get half of the deals I get. Each one brings me exactly what I'm looking for and that alone is priceless!

I also recommend getting the amount of your fee on a seperate contract. :deal It's less complicated that way. Then there will be no confussion on what you are getting for each closed deal. I do have some that don't require the contract but I have worked with them a long time.

Anyway that's my 2 Cents.




Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: LuckyBuysYuckyHouses on December 29, 2007, 08:57:34 pm
Interesting post.... :smile
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on January 09, 2008, 10:07:14 pm
No problem, just keep moving forward.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: closer2home on January 12, 2008, 12:50:25 pm
Linda made a great point! I've used non-circumvention agreements to assure payment. This is a simple 1 page form you can find online for free with a simple search. You worked for it, protect it!  :bobble
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on February 06, 2008, 09:30:15 pm
I figure I would put this thread up to the top again, as there are still questions about birddoging that I believe I have answered so far. If there are any more questions, feel free to ask the forum.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on August 27, 2008, 01:00:02 am
Floating this one to the top again. I added a poll. let me know if you think it was helpful, as I'd like to know what you think I should of included.

-Lamar
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: oahuopps on August 27, 2008, 04:10:11 pm

Lamar, this post was very helpful.  I had a question about fees. You mentioned $500-$1,000 as a commission. I have heard investors offering a % of the profits.  Is the birddog fee normally a flat fee structure or percentages that you have used?

Do you know where I could find a basic contract to use between the investor and property finder?

Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on August 27, 2008, 07:49:48 pm
Oahuopps,

    It can bee whatever you work out with the investor. It doesn't have to be a flat fee. Also it doesn't have to be $500 - $1000 either... It could be more or less... but usually that is what I see on average. As far as percentages, I've personally seen 1/2 to 1 %. Again, its whatever you two agree to.

As far as finding an agreement. I would google it. Look for Property Locator Agreement or Birddog agreement. Also, you can post that question in this forum as well as other forums to find where people are getting there's from. I had one through a birddog site that I signed up for when I first got started. They actually updated their site. Haven't been there in a while, but you could check it out and they may have what your looking for. Again, I used them a long time ago and I didn't do deals through them, so I don't know their criteria or anything now. They actually shut down for a while. Looks like they're back. Check it out: www.Birddogz.com and hopefully you'll find what you're looking for.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: RDO on September 11, 2008, 09:19:34 am
I thought bird dogs got paid after the contract was signed, not at closing.  Wholesalers get paid at closing.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: RDO on September 11, 2008, 09:30:21 am
When I was bird dogging, I would have several investors lined up.  I would email them all about a property, without providing the address info.   When one of the investors said they were interested, I would send this email agreement to them.

---------

This email constitutes a contract agreement, whereas in consideration of services to be rendered by YOUR NAME (Finder), and YOUR INVESTOR (Client) hereby employs Finder to refer to Client a prospective:
 
1. Finder agrees not to participate in or conduct any negotiations with prospects, or solicit loans on behalf of prospects. Finder is not licensed by the Texas Department of Real Estate.

2. Finder hereby delivers to Client the name and identity of the following prospect:

Name:
Address:
Telephone:

3. Finder hereby delivers to Client particulars concerning a real estate parcel that Client might want:

Address:
Legal Description:
Other: (Attached File)

4. As compensation for Finder's referral, Client agrees to pay Finder $1,000.00 upon the closing and sale of the transaction involving the above-cited real property, or upon the closing of the first transaction involving the above-cited prospect.

5. Should the prospect or the property not result in a transaction involving Client within 12 months of the date of this agreement, Client shall owe Finder no compensation.


Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: memphisblues on September 12, 2008, 06:53:23 pm
I seem to have the opposite problem from most of you and don't know why.  I have way too many properties due to great buying model, but lack investor pools.  I can buy houses, have my rehab crews and rental dept as well as prop management, so I can still sell my props at around 70% ARV rented and with assistance with hard money and perm financing for great opportunity for investors.  Great rental market here and houses are cheap.  Just cannot find enough investors that want a passive income with no money of their own invested.  Seems simple, but i guess I spend all my time on the projects I am not out with the investor world...any advice?       
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: FJ on September 13, 2008, 07:02:02 am
Great Post - The "go getter" type bird dog's have proven invaluable to me. I like to throw in unexpected bonuses or incentive so they call me first any time they have a great deal. Something like fee + $100 gas card......especially since they are my only person on the ground in some areas.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: amvg07 on September 22, 2008, 02:13:24 am
Hello All

I'm new to the real estate world and I want to start out by bird dogging.  Does anyone know some great questions to ask the seller to get them to drive to sell their property so I can give it to an investors?  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: ambitioness on September 22, 2008, 11:00:07 am
 :biggrin  Thanks for the information.  This really helped me out alot!
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: americanindian on September 23, 2008, 10:20:10 am
 :biggrin Hey Lamar,
        That is very good input I didn't think of it that way keep up the good work. It directs me in the right way
of doing things.
Thank-You
\
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: peterv on October 30, 2008, 07:21:44 pm
Whether you're a novice real estate investor or you've been at it for years, real estate investing is an endless series of challenges.  First, you have to locate motivated sellers.  Then you have to buy it right, manage it even better, and still find a way to turn a profit.  To top it off, you have to try to do all these things while simultaneously juggling the myriad other details of your life while laying the groundwork to become a full-time investor.
There just isn't enough time in the day, is there?
Wouldn't it be nice if profitable deals would almost magically come to you?
Well, they can.
By putting Bird Dogs to work for you there's more time for you to concentrate your energies on more profitable activities: negotiating with sellers, putting together winning proposals, and moving on to the next deal.
In case you're not familiar with what a bird dog is - or what a bird dog does - they are basically scouts that sniff out deals for you.  Their sole job is to locate properties that have motivated sellers and lay the groundwork for you to move in and close the deal.  This saves you time for the really profitable aspects of real estate investing.
While all bird dogs are not Realtors, Realtors have a huge advantage over non Realtor bird dogs, for obvious reasons: They have access to the local MLS, FLMS listings, they know the neighborhood, they know how long the homes are on the market, they know what buyers are looking for, they know what it will take to get it in resale condition, they have access to motivated buyers and sellers or can find them for you.
Without motivated sellers you can't put together real estate deals.  The problem you have is there are only so many hours in the day for you to do everything that needs to be done.  If you still have a full-time job working for someone else you have even less time available for your marketing and prospecting efforts.  If you assume that marketing - of which locating motivated sellers is a critical part - takes 20%-25% of your time, you can easily see how little time that leaves for the other activities you need to be doing on an on-going basis to reach your goals.
By having a bird dog or bird dogs doing these things for you it allows you to better utilize the time resources you have at your disposal.  A good bird dog isn't born: they're made.  It's going to take a little effort on your part to help your bird dogs help you.  The best way for you to do this is by clearly articulating to them what you need. Again, here is where Realtors can be invaluable, because you will spend less time bringing Realtors up to speed as they already have had extensive training.
The good news is that there are plenty of people willing to be bird dogs.  They could be friends, family members, or others you come in contact with.  You can also work with novice real estate investors through your local REIA to locate properties for you.  It's also relatively easy to put together larger teams of bird dogs by utilizing message boards, Craig's List, and other online resources.  If all else fails you can run a newspaper ad of your own.  The main point here is that bird dogs will free up more of your time so you can do those things that have a greater probability of earning you money.
Bird dogs can be the path to your real estate investing goals.  The finder's fees you'll pay your bird dogs for bringing deals to you are more than offset by the value - and the wealth - they'll generate for you.  Take the time to learn how to work with bird dogs in reaching your investing dreams.  As you get better at working with bird dogs you'll find that you have more time and money for other pursuits - like deciding what to tell your boss when you quit your full-time job and take the plunge into full-time real estate investing.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: daniel08 on November 07, 2008, 12:41:22 am
amgvo7,

Ask them why they are selling the property and you will see how motivated they are.  Its more a question of how motivated they already are, not how motivated you can make them.  If they are not very motivated to sell, in other words, if they are not becoming stressed over not selling the property, you may not want to waste your time.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on November 12, 2008, 01:03:45 am
I like the Gas Card+ Fee concept FJ. Nothing like putting an extra incentive in there to get the help you need.  :bobble
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Icangetitdone on November 12, 2008, 03:57:53 pm
So Lamar, and by the way great post very informative, do you think or anyone for that matter think beginning wholesalers can use birddoggers for their benefit?

I mean bird dogs seem very valuable  :bobble and the roles between the bird dog and wholsaler seem very similar. So is the main difference between the bird dog and wholseller that A birdog brings a potential deal to my attention and i can either buy or resell do whatever, versus the wholseller ties up the property under contract and then is able to sell his position for a higher profit?

All the post on here are priceless thanks for the info :beer
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on November 13, 2008, 09:47:58 pm
Wholesalers can definitely use birddogs to their advantage! Without a doubt! :beer

The key difference between a birddog and a wholesaler, is that usually the birddog finds the deal and the Wholesaler negotiates, handles paperwork, and closes the deal. Typically, the birddog gets paid when the Wholesaler gets paid. As for the amount, that is between the Wholesaler and the Birddog!
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: chiconya on November 17, 2008, 07:12:55 pm
Thanks. you summed it all up really well!
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: CHEYENNE1RAIN on November 23, 2008, 01:38:40 pm
Hi,


I loved the to the point, common sense article, . Can you or someone else go into more clearly how to find investors who are willing to work with new people to birddogging ?
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: RDO on November 26, 2008, 09:47:27 am
I thought that BirdDogs got paid at signing of Contract, and Wholesalers got paid at closing plus an upfront deposit.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on November 27, 2008, 12:36:24 am
It all depends on the investor that birddog is dealing with. Normally what I've seen and experienced is that the birddog gets paid when the Wholesaler gets paid. This is due to the fact that the wholesaler will take a cut out of his profit in order to compensate the birddog for bringing a deal that actually closed. Some may argue that the birddog already did they're part by bringing the deal to the table, however there could be many variables that could cause that deal to fall through, therefore causing someone to lose money. Nobody wants that to happen. Therefore that could be why it's normally structured in that manner. Again, this is just my own personal experience.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: AJ™ on December 17, 2008, 02:29:47 pm
Wow, this thread has a large amount of information I was looking for.  Im just starting out and have read many posts and articles on this site but also would like to buy a book or course on bird dogging. 

Are there any that you guys can recommend?

Thanks
AJ
SoCal
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Mr Investor on December 17, 2008, 03:24:34 pm
Try Barry Grimes Real Estate Jobbing 101 nothing but great review from that course.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: AJ™ on December 17, 2008, 07:24:05 pm
I think Im going to get that course.  I have heard other people also recommend it as well.  I want to start bird dogging then move onto Wholesaling :bobble

Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: WHC on December 31, 2008, 07:27:15 pm

Lamar... I see where there is supposed to be classified section on REICLUB, but me being a guy, I guess I can't find it. Maybe I need to have my wife help me.    :smile   

I am looking for bird dogs in Pittsburgh and Cleveland to help locate apartment buildings 20 units or more. I don't know where to post! Can you or someone help me out? This post has been very informative!

Thanks, Bill   :anon


The purpose of this posting is to give you Birddogs (Property Locator sounds better) a little help in getting started in the birddog world. I just want to outline your responsibilities as a birddog and how to avoid pitfalls, which may discourage your efforts.

STEP 1. Find an Investor to Birddog for.
         
          -You can find investors anywhere. ReiClub is a great start. Look at the Investor Ads for your state and find out if that Investor gives out referral/finder fees for properties that you locate for them

           - You can alsways advertise your services in the REICLUB Classified Ad Section.  
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Mdhaas on December 31, 2008, 09:56:08 pm

Quote
I see where there is supposed to be classified section on REICLUB, but me being a guy, I guess I can't find it.

Bill,

The classified section was discontinued as it was overrun by SPAM.  Your best bet is to advertise/recruit in the local markets.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: marian on January 08, 2009, 04:49:50 pm
Hello, i'm new to the board.  Great discussion!  This may be a no no, but still with tax season ....  How would you file bird-dog, wholesale income?  What general field/activity,  real estate; other?  Type of service and customers?
a) property locator for real estate investment companies
b) consulting to real estate investment companies
c) real estate investing
d) other ideas

Not seeking pro advise, just your ideas? Thanks! 
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on January 26, 2009, 12:54:56 am
Hey Marian,

    I haven't been on in a while, but I just saw your question. I try not to involve myself with these type of questions, because I am not a tax advisor.

The best advice I can give you is to talk to a CPA. Some states might handle this matter differently, but just talk to your CPA and they will handle everything for you.

This is exaclty what I did when I recieved my first birddog check.

Trust me, this isn't complicated at all and you actually should be able to get a free consultation regarding this.
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: ClevelandSlim on May 09, 2009, 05:13:02 pm
Excellent post Lamar!  I definitely took notes, and will read often.

Hey, what happened to Bill WHC?  Bill, are you still looking for help in the Cleveland area?

All the best,
Kieran
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: Lamar on May 11, 2009, 12:31:30 am
Thanks Kieran. Hope it helps... I might add some updates soon. Not sure yet...
Title: Re: ATTENTION BIRDDOGS. THIS IS A MUST READ FOR YOU!!
Post by: reitx on November 15, 2009, 03:23:20 pm
This is a great post! thanks for sharing.  I have a question tho...

How does on bird dog for REO properties? I have some REO properties that I am currently reviewing and still not at the point where I can invest personally, but they are great deals. Any advise on this will be much appreciated.

Thanks!