Real Estate Investing Forums

Real Estate Investing => Financing, Hard Money Lenders, Private Money => Topic started by: wealthrx on November 30, 2006, 08:17:58 pm

Title: Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: wealthrx on November 30, 2006, 08:17:58 pm
I have come across a few companies that claim to offer seasoned credit trade lines
with great pay history and low balances for sale. The costs start @ 500 - 1k per trade.

If anyone has had experience with this please post reply.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 01, 2006, 06:44:05 pm
Seasoned tradelines are great.  I actually have purchased about 5 of them and my credit score went from a 608 to a 680 in about 50 days.  I now work for the company as a sales rep.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: DeeinAustin on December 01, 2006, 08:13:06 pm
You have to also remember that Stikee is also selling these and making money off people who do them. I think that link is to a company he works for or is affiliated with, correct?
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: 71tr on December 01, 2006, 08:44:07 pm
Yeah, this just seems like an attempt to game the system.  I would be skeptical of the promised results.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: markoarko on December 01, 2006, 09:11:40 pm
Ok Ok, im certainly not the saint of the group,

And I realize the site claims that this is completely legal, and I have no way of nor desire to prove its not legal

BUT


Does it strike anyone that IF: (below has been cut and past from the site)

Recently denied credit
Can't get approved for a mortgage
Can't get approved for any loan
Low Credit Scores
Late Payments
No Credit Scores

***That by paying money to get trade lines that are supposed to increase your score (ie the an actual accounting of what your pay history is), but in fact your paying to put on credit history that you have not earned

Is maybe a little bit shady?

Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 01, 2006, 11:19:53 pm
I'm letting you know about the service and about the results that worked in my personal situation.  ASR Solutions is now a company I work for yes...however, I signed up with them after they enhanced my credit.  Anyone can sign up with them.  They just pay you a referral fee.  I don't go out of my way to prove how great the service is.  There is a big enough market out there of people who are in desperate need of the service.   Everyone knows that when you add years of credit payment history to your credit profile that it boosts up your scores.  Credit scores are generated by a computer program, not a person who picks a number out of their hat.  Calculating systems  don't lie.  When people have low credit scores, particularly under a 600 middle score, it is because of a specific reason or set of factors that have adversely affected their risk level.  The biggest impact on any credit score are 3 things.

1. Length of time account open  (the longer the better)
2. Credit limit vs. Balance ratio  ( the smaller the better)
3. Payment history (only on time payments are acceptable)
Any negative information attached to these 3 subjects affect your score the worst.  

Mortgages, collection accounts, judgments, liens and inquiries don't nearly have the impact of the 3 subjects above.  Yes they bring down your score, but you can offset it with more positive information than negative information.  Credit scores are a range of numbers that tell creditors how likely you are to repay them if they issue you credit.  If your scores are too low that means your credit report or profile does not show enough positive information in regards to the 3 main points above.  Therefore lenders consider you a high risk.  Seasoned Tradelines add established timely payment history and low balances to your credit report.  Right now, credit card companies report authorized users the same way they report co-borrowers or joint account holders.  The information on your credit report does not show the date you were added to the account, but instead it shows the date the accounts were added.  This is how the payment history transfers to your account.  
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 01, 2006, 11:34:37 pm
It is not a secret that seasoned tradelines  are  purchased by people who are using other peoples payment history to get ahead.  That is the whole point of  the program.   However, keep in mind that credit card companies are the ones who actually do the adding of the authorized user, not us.  We just help people find the best accounts to get added to.  Some people think it's shady, some people think it's unfair or even down right wrong.  But who cares...unless people who feel that way become law makers or start up their own credit card companies and create their own rules....it does not matter.  All opinions are respected..but they don't matter in the real world.   Regardless of what people think...it's legal...do some research, or better yet if you have any credit cards call them yourself and see how many authorized users you can add.  Some AMEX cards allow up to 99 authorized users!!  And no opinion can change that fact.  Bottom line is..there are way too many people that the credit bureaus screw over because of a bad time in their life.  Why should someone who got a credit card at 18, in college with no job suffer at 30 when they may possibly be more responsible now.  That is not fair, bot nobody complains about that.   And let;s not talk about these shady credit card companies that are a bunch of loan sharks.  It's no problem when people have to pay back outrageous fees in interest to the credit card companies or should I say crooks.  But...when the average hard working, tax paying American finds a way to either get a second chance at reaching their financial goals or...finds away to save a few thousand dollars in interest, it automatically has to be deemed as probably illegal or some type of scam.  We are so programmed to think that we have to just accept the way it is.  I'm glad to help people who need to be helped.  If their intentions are bad, then that's on them.  But I don't see why anyone would pay so much money to increase their scores just to screw up again.  It would be a waste.    
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: markoarko on December 01, 2006, 11:59:26 pm
stikkee

i respect your opinion and business idea on selling the trade lines, i simply dont agree with principle of representing anything ever that is not the truth

i also agree that the credit monopoly has little to be desired, but in fact, i know as a lender that when calcualted overall, the "guy" who has earned his 800 credit score will pay me as though his life depended on it, out of shear integrity, whereas the young 20 something, who has a 700 score, because he has not had time to actually do anything to put him in a catagory to have risked any bad credit, is willing to walk away from his debt obligations at the drop of a hat;

but i do feel its getting better, giving consumers more options to correct incorrect information, etc

finally, my description of shady is maybe a bit harse (although I offer no specific apology) because I strongly feel that the mortage industry will sooner or later come down on what I perceive as peoples reckless fabrication of the truth in real estate transactions

and if that time ever comes, with respect, I think that a program such as the one you are touting will be a lightning rod for critisizm

Having said all that, I wish you luck in whatever entreprenuerial endeavors you should partake in.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 02, 2006, 12:10:16 am
Thank you for wishing me luck.  But I must say that creditors and mortgage bankers are their own downfall.  Any good mortgage underwriter who truly knows their stuff can look at any credit report and tell if the person is the account holder, joint account holder or authorized user.   There are numbered codes on the sides of each and every account.  Most people just don't know what they mean.  The score is not the only thing that should be used to determine if a person qualifies for mortgage.  The overall history and type of account is not taken into consideration.  Why?? people think 700 score, I'm going to get paid.  People with 700 scores may just have been lucky to not have gotten laid off, sick, have a child, death in the family or divorce.  The credit system is a joke.   The reason this is overlooked is because most underwriting is done by DU (desktop underwriting) or DO (desktop origination)  The old school, pick a file apart method when out the window about 10 years ago.  Lenders rely on computers and not their own knowledge to break down the accounts on credit reports.  Sp they don't have to lend to people who's credit scores are high because of authorized user status.  They can choose to only lend to people who are Primary account holders.  But they choose not to.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: christopher w on December 02, 2006, 10:39:31 am
Stickee,

It sounds like your judgement is getting a bit clouded because you have a financial connection to this product. Obviously if your score was a 608 you have had some credit issues in the past your fault or not. So by increasing your score toa 680 did it solve the issues that caused you to have a low score or have you just grown older and realized that being responsible and paying your bills on time is the right way to do things. All you are doing is offering a band-aid solution to someone who probably needs a lot more help than three or four credit lines can offer. What happens when the customer gets that 680 and go get way more home or credit than they can possibly afford? Now they are in worse shape than before. You talk about brokers being there own downfall... Hello pot.. Its me kettle.. Your black!!

Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: wealthrx on December 02, 2006, 12:21:11 pm
IMO
 
I think that the seasoned trade line program is a great product for people that may have borderline scores.
If someone has a 610 fico but needs 10-20-50 points added then it does not harm anyone too severly.
Conversely, there are people that have no business with a higher score because they will wrongly abuse
the system. What about Stated income, no doc deals?? There are people with one or two tradelines that
have 700 plus scores and little income that can go no doc and get into financial trouble buying more home
than they can rightfully afford based solely on the score!!

Listen the seasoned line program is a tool just like many of the niche mortage products offered, that help to
enhance a borderline borrowers purchasing power. Nothing more nothing less, no program is perfect for every
borrower & there will always be a segment of people who abuse the system no matter what.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 02, 2006, 06:52:15 pm
Seasoned tradelines are the best way to go if you need a rapid credit score increase.  If you need to boost your score in the next 45 days.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: dnburgess on December 02, 2006, 09:46:52 pm
Can you send me the webiste for this company?

---

He can email it to you instead of posting here.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: yrush2000 on December 03, 2006, 09:28:37 am
Hello All...Well I have been on this site for quiet a while and you can see from the number of posting I have plus I have had arguements with several people on here about things but need to throw in my 2cents here..

The concept of seasoned tradelines is, a company deals with a network of investors(not $$ types) who have perfect tradeline histories. These individuals will allow you to add your name to their account as an authorized user which will boost your score within 90days as the account needs to complete its cycles. After 90days your removed from the account and thats it.  Yes it is expensive and actually $1000 is a good price but thats probably for a low dollar tradeline around $2000..  Price of tradeline has to be with the dollar amount of the line since the higher the dollar amount, the better your credit score can become and willingness for lenders to offer higher credit limits.

I actually developed a relationship with a person recently who deals with the CPN (consumer Protection number) this is new and yes expensive (around $5500) but what they do is move all your good info from your social security number to the CPN file and will add tradelines, but that also cost. The pricing schedule varies on what you want done. He also deals with creating a Paydex file as well.  Whole price is said to take 45days but you can not use for 90days and you need the file to cycle itself to be right.

I actually decided to try this and he reduced my upfront fee as I want to see if it works because I come in contact with many people with bad credit and they can benifit from it.  If this works, will I push it, YES..but I will push it with proof, showing my credit report before it started and the new report with new tradelines and corp setup as well..

One thing people do not know. Social Secuirty numbers were created for the gov't to keep track of your earning for retirement and taxes. Never intended for credit purposes. Banks adopted this.. No where in the constitution or govt rules does it state it is required. Now companies have the CPN to issue and are costly.  Many of the people dealing with these come from the credit breaua like EXP,TU, or EQU.  They have inside people to clean the reports and create new numbers to use for credit. Thats all it is used for and its aged as well. You do not use it for employement or taxes. but can buy real estate with it.

If it works, I will become an associate and yes make money from the a proven system. Till I see the results I will not push the product since I want proof it works and have the funds to see if it does.

But trust me, if it does, who would not spend $5000-$8000 to have a new history and go and buy more and better..

andrew
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 03, 2006, 10:53:52 am
Sounds as though the CPN is a pretty cool thing.  Just to clear up some of the confusion, we don't charge based on how high the credit limit is.  Believe it or not, how high the credit limit is does not change the outcome.  It is the credit limit vs balance ratio that is the most important.   At ASR SOLUTIONS we don't just increase your scores and send you on your way.  We educate our clients about credit secrets and give them real knowledge about how credit scoring works.   Our prices are very very affordable and we also have payment plans if necessary.

1 tradeline is $500! (for the person who needs a small boost 20-35pts and also for the person who has no history at all or no score can expect around a 650 middle score)

2 tradelines $900 (A bigger boost around 35 points per tradeline and for the person with no history or score they can expect to see a score around 665 to 685)

3 tradelines for $1350  + the 4th one FREE!  ( A huge jump usually about 100 to 120 points and for a person with no scores at all they can expect about a 690 to 710!!!)

4 tradelines for $1850 + the 5th one free (You can expect a score increase anywhere from 100 to 200 points! with no scores at all, you guarantee a 700+ score)

*******Depending on how bad the persons information is, the results can be less.  But the overall idea still works, they may just need to purchase more tradelines************
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: wealthrx on December 03, 2006, 11:13:07 am
WOW!! I am glad that I decided to start this topic on seasoned trade lines.
All of the comments by Stikkee (sp) have been right on target in terms of
supplying valuable information. It seems like No One has been able to dispute
the facts that she has presented in the thread. I am so impressed that I am
considering getting 5 lines for my girl as an early x-mas gift(among other things).

If anyone can refute the statements that have been made in thread please post....
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: DeeinAustin on December 03, 2006, 11:26:35 am
I still think it's just a big ad for their company. If you guys want to advertise, please pay for it by using the classifieds or network ads offered. You are consistently not following forum rules by posting your website and phone.

The purpose of this forum is to share information and experience. Obiously, since they are selling these, they cannot be unbiased. Their profiles have no information about them except a basic email address.

TIPS FOR BEGINNERS

1. If someone is boasting about their company's product and they have a small number of posts, DO NOT trust them. BEWARE when someone joins REIclub and most of their posts directly benefit them financially. Until someone has at least 50-100 posts, you don't know who you are dealing with.

2. See if a trusted, experienced investor in your area thinks about this topic since there are many ways to boost credit. Don't fall for people who join, then spend all of their time making a case as to why you should call to buy something.

3. Bring up the topic in trusted local circles. Meet with the tradeline provider or their rep in person, get three local referrals, and make sure the company is a BBB member at the least. If you deal with someone who you can easily identify and they have a local office, there's less of a chance of being scammed.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: wealthrx on December 03, 2006, 11:41:58 am
Dee are you saying that a program such as this does not work or what?
Have you heard of any complaints from consumers regarding buying lines?
I have yet to hear from anyone with a horror story or negative experience at all.
Thanks.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: markoarko on December 03, 2006, 11:55:15 am
Now Im surely not living in a bubble, and realize
1) Credit reporting agencies are aften inaccuarate and cost us money borrowing (however I believe there are tools in place to fix this legitimately)
2) I also realize that people who invest like us, utilizing cheap debt from the mortgage markets can save $1000s by having a 750 instead of a 600, or conversely having good credit instead of bad

BUT, I also think, as someone who now lends money to investors, I need to have some way of knowing if the guy is going to pay me back or not.

Knowing that the system is so easily manipulated, and I have been aware of this my whole carreer, gives me a considerable pause in lending to anyone, in my opinion, thereby hurting the system

A small story about myself, early in my carreer I borrowed a bunch of money and didnt pay it back. = Score when into the toilet, couldnt borrow to save my life. But because I needed capital, I found other ways, individuals, hard money guys, other real estate investors to partner with, etc. They new my c-scores sucked, but they also knew what I was doing could be profitable. They also looked over every deal with a finer tooth comb because I had this credit strike against me.

And I, my business and my lenders are better off for it now. I have now developed huge credit lines, significant trust, which I hold dear and a better business model because of it. And its because when I had problems, I believe I handled it in a legitimate, honest way. And with all of its problems and inefficiencys, i believe that our current credit system is at least legitimate and honest (HEY, no rotten tomatoes being thrown).

I further believe, paying money, to aquire a good history that is not your own, is not honest. As a lender (and note I am such a small player that I doubt I would ever even meet any of your), I wouldnt lend to you on the shear principle that "you" utilized this service as a way to make your real record/history/credit look better.

So as I step down from the soapbox, I just ask that each prospective buyer of this service think about the long term, and not just about saving a little money on the next deal.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: Rich_in_CT on December 04, 2006, 01:44:39 pm
There are a million other ways to raise your score without paid/scam products.  
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 04, 2006, 02:05:47 pm
Unfortunately there are no other ways to raise credit scores without having to pay for something.  Either you have to pay off the debt that  caused you to have a low credit score in the first place or you have to pay for a service that will help you fix the problem.  One way or another you have to pay someone.  We can always separate the people who are serious about increasing their credit from the those that would probably default again anyway.  Those who try to find a way around paying for their past mistakes are usually the same people who have a habit of just "not paying bills period."  There is no better way to secure a promise to pay, than to collect cash.  Most people who are willing to pay for a service like credit enhancement or credit repair, work hard to keep it up once it's fixed.  For example, most people who default on mortgages got 100% financing.  It's easier to let something go when you put none of your own money down.  But on the opposite side... when your own hard earned money was put into something, you usually work harder to maintain it.  We feel confident working with individuals who pay us for our service because we know the chances of them defaulting on future loans is much less than before.  We encourage people to educate themselves on how to fix their own credit and if they find a way to do it, and are able to save money...GREAT!  But the reality is, most people have gotten themselves into a rut and need some assistance.  That's where we come in, and we are very glad to help.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: Rich_in_CT on December 04, 2006, 02:17:55 pm
There are plenty of ways to remove negatives from a report besides paying some scam service to use some sort of phony service to screw around with paperwork and create some sort of smokescreen.  For those interested in cleaning up their credit using other non-paid methods try http://creditboards.com - they have a ton of good info and don't charge a dime.

Quote
We can always separate the people who are serious about increasing their credit from the those that would probably default again anyway.  Those who try to find a way around paying for their past mistakes are usually the same people who have a habit of just "not paying bills period."
I wouldn't pay for any such service and I certainly pay every bill I have on time or early.  Besides if I were to pay for my past mistakes (if I had any) I'd rather pay the creditor (I borrowed money from them in the first place) rather than some 3rd party.  Its only right to pay back your obligations right?  How does someone that is willing to take a quick out prove to anyone that they will pay their debts in the future, after all rather than pay their creditors they are hiding behind ghost accounts to make their score go up.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: wealthrx on December 04, 2006, 02:25:27 pm
WoW..

Alot of general statements/accusations being made, but no real evidence
that the services offered are a sham (to consumers). I think everyone
agrees that it just may work (for the consumer).

Anyone that has tried these services feel free to share your experience..
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: thailanddave on December 04, 2006, 02:44:31 pm
As a mortgage banker, I work on the other side of the desk. Let me venture a guess as to how this works. Any company can report to the credit bureau for a fee. I think it's between $2-$10 per month per person. Of course there are probably reduced fees for big companies like Visa/Mastercard. The bureau updates their records usually once a month. We call it running the tape, because they used to be all on tape drives. The creditor uploads their files with the latest info and that info is updated on the master computer, so when someone requests credit on Social Security #xxx-xx-xxxx, the computer spits out the most recent updates. This is why you will see some creditors with an X in the most recent column. this means the the creditor has not reported for those months.

An algorithm devised by Fair Issac company is run. The 3 bureaus all use the Fair Issac algorithm but have tuned it different. Its a big secret on how they actually have it tuned.

Why this probably works - unless somebody challenges the accounts put on the credit bureau computers, it will be accepted as truth.

The "tapes" are only run once a month, which is why it normally takes 30-90 days to get something removed from your bureau. You have to dispute it with the creditor (30 days or more) and then wait until all 3 bureaus run their tapes to get the newly updated info from the creditor removing the blemish.

This is also why credit repair bureaus don't work too well. The repair bureaus took advantage of a loop hole in the fair credit reporting act. According to the law, if you dispute something on your record and they can't resolve it in 30 days, they have to remove it until it was resolved. In the past, there were only a few people in the resolution office, so repair agencies would inundate them with error requests until finally, something slipped past the 30 day mark. That doesn't work anymore since they have started labelling the disputes on the date they were first submitted. They don't remove it, they label it as under dispute. The creditor has a period of time to respond to the bureau (I think 30-60 days). Since it is in the best interest of the creditor to update their files and respond to disputes, anything a repair company removes through the loop hole will be back on the bureau in about 90 days.

Most mortgage loan officers have access to "Rapid Rescore". If you have a legitimate error on your report and have documentation from the creditor, I can get it corrected in 48 hours. This does not always mean an increase in your score, because it looks like an additional "access" to your records. Part of the credit scoring system analyzes the number of "accesses". I have actually removed items from peoples bureau and had their scores go down.

Paying off a collection before you buy something will usually cause the score to go down temporarily, as it causes additional accesses. The collection will still show up on the bureau report but show PAID IN FULL. This makes a difference to the underwriter of your loan but not your credit score. Usually all collections must be paid before closing so they don't slip a lien in before your mortgage gets recorded which would put your banker in 2nd position after the lien. So paying off collections can often be a condition of closing but in credit score driven lending, it makes sense to pay them at closing, not before to get an increase in your score (which almost never happens).

Finally, the adding of seasoned accounts is probably working for the time being. It is a scam since they are not your accounts. The credit bureaus are not stupid. They will close this loophole when they discover it since their business is based on accurate reporting.

When we do a mortgage, we ask for at least 3 active credit lines. If the lines havent been updated, we will ask for an update from the bureau before we can count those accounts.

What Im saying is if you need it now, use it while its available. But don't expect those items to be there in the future. The companies setting up your fake history won't continue to report every month, its too expensive. When we call to get an update, there will be no update and you won't be able to count that line. Its a one-time short-term fix at best.  
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 04, 2006, 02:45:05 pm
I am not disputing the fact that people should pay their bills.  People who borrow money or receive a service have a responsibility to repay their creditors and/or service providers.  That is a fact.  But paying your old creditors does not have a big enough impact on your credit score.  Sometimes it has no effect at all.  For example, even after someone  pays off their old collection accounts, creditors have the right to report that information for 7 years.  Even after it is paid, they still list it as a derogatory account.   That person will most likely continue to be denied credit because that negative payment history has such a bad reflection on the persons FICO, almost no one will give them a loan.  If they can find a way to increase their score for free...great for them.  I hope they share how they were able to do that with the rest of the world.  But in reality, people will always need loans and good credit scores to do almost everything in this country.  If we can help give people a second chance, I don't see anything that is wrong with that.  The reason most people who destroy their credit is due to a lack of financial knowledge and education.  Many people don't even know how credit cards work and how they should utilize them.  Like I said before, we educate people on how to manage their credit and how to make better financial decisions.  Of course there will be people who take advantage of this program, as there will be people who never pay their taxes and people who drive without a insurance.  Some people always try to get around doing what is right.   But there are a bigger number of people who either had a bad time in their life and fell behind or simply need a break because every day life has broken them down.  The only people who oppose these types of programs are people who...

A. Never got a break, and are mad that other people are getting one
B. Have excellent credit and feel that this program is unfair
C. Creditors

My favorite group of people to help are the Katrina victims.  Many of them have gotten screwed by the government and creditors who refused to extend them time to get their lives back together.  We have helped many of them increase their credit scores and they have been able to get loans and mortgages.  Most people are honest and genuine of getting a small piece of the American Dream.







Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 04, 2006, 03:53:38 pm
Thailandave.... Before you misinform people about how the credit bureaus work, you should do your homework.  Your implying that seasoned tradelines are a scam and it will not work eventually.  Please back up your statements with proof before you make such comments.  Adding someone as an authorized user is not anywhere close to being a scam.  If it is a scam, why do credit card companies allow account holders to add people as authorized users?  And better yet, why do some of these credit card companies allow as many as 99 authorized users to be added to a single account? And even more so...why do they report them to the credit bureaus?  
Do you truly want to know why?  It is simply because of these important laws that you may or may not know about.  

#1. The FCRA  (Fair credit reporting act)

      &

#2.  The ECOA (Equal Credit opportunity act)

which are both monitored by the Federal Trade Commission.  

If you go to the FTC's website and click on laws and facts for consumers, you will see that creditors have to report authorized users to the credit bureaus.  Some credit card companies do it automatically,  and for those that do not do it automatically .....if they receive a request in writing from the account holder, they have no choice.  The FTC acknowledges that every person has the right to establish a credit history and yes that includes authorized users.  Authorized user accounts are part of the account holders account file.  An account holder can have all aspects of their account reported...once again, that includes an authorized user.  

Lastly, the information reported on the authorized users credit is not "FAKE HISTORY" as you implied earlier.  It is real history for that particular credit card, which that person happens to be an authorized user.  As long as credit card companies allow authorized users, this law won't change.  

Rich men..have rich wives and rich children.  The credit card companies know that the Donald Trump's of the world may not go shopping every weekend, but they know that his wife and children may.  But yet..who is responsible for paying the debt....can you guess?  Not his wife, but Donald.  I doubt that we will ever see the day that creditors stop allowing authorized users.  They want more people to be authorized users because the credit companies love for people run up their credit.  It's just more money for them in interest.  But we have found a way for this same rule for the rich, to help other people get a chance at becoming rich....Or just a little better off!  
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: thailanddave on December 04, 2006, 04:54:10 pm
ROFLMAO.
I have been in the mortgage business since 1988. You added accounts that weren't yours to your credit bureau and are now an expert.

If you add accounts that aren't yours to your credit report it is 1. illegal 2. a scam.

I didn't say it wouldn't work and detailed exactly how your company does it. It wont last because your company will not keep updating the tapes with that show accounts that arent legitimate. 1. they can't afford to 2. they got their $1000 and they are down the road.

It will get stopped but it may take a while. Why? Because the bureau don't have the resources to re-check every company who is reporting to the credit bureau. More likely they will black list the company who got approved to update the credit bureau lists. If your company is smart and I have no doubt they are, they have applied and been approved for several, maybe hundreds of accounts that are allowed to update the bureaus records. So when they get black listed on one account, they will simply let if fall by the wayside and use the next account.

You can't put inaccurrate information on somebody's credit bureau for long and hope to get away with it forever. (I suppose next you will tell me its legitimate info) It's illegal and although you as a representative are not likely to get caught, your company will.

Anyone who is using such practices is committing fraud. If they ever go bad on their loans and probably will because their low credit scores indicate  they don't pay their bills, they can be brought up for prosecution. Will it happen? Maybe, maybe not. The amount of loan fraud in the last few years is rampant and loan officers are going to jail every day for it. Something that really hasn't happened before.

If the loan company ever prosecutes a borrower and finds a check to a company that put false records on their credit report... well you figure it out.

Have a nice day.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 04, 2006, 05:38:18 pm
Please don't take this the wrong way, but you really have limited knowledge on how this program works.  Once again, your information is inaccurate.  This is not a scam...and it is not illegal.  

For the last time.... WE ARE NOT THE ONES WHO REPORT THE ACCOUNT INFORMATION TO THE CREDIT BUREAUS.  THE CREDIT CARD COMPANIES DO ALL THE REPORTING, AND THE CREDIT BUREAUS DISPLAY WHAT THE CREDITORS REPORTED TO THEM.

I do not manipulate credit reports in any way.  The information on our  clients credit reports are 100% accurate in the fact that they are authorized users on the accounts.  Nothing more, nothing less.  Your trying very hard to make this program into something it's not.

And for your information, before I got involved with ASR Solutions,  I was a sub-prime mortgage underwriter.  I would think that someone who claims to be in the mortgage industry since 1988 would know a little more than you do about how this whole credit system works.  But then again, that's why I no longer underwrite because I could not deal with incompetent loan officers who always think they know everything.  
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: thailanddave on December 04, 2006, 05:48:27 pm
So if I am an authorized user on the account I can go and charge stuff on these other peoples accounts? Now that sounds like a deal!

Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: wealthrx on December 04, 2006, 05:57:30 pm
OK..Ok..Ok. Do we need to seperate you two ?

Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 04, 2006, 06:26:15 pm
Absolutely not...our clients never get access to these credit cards.  The cards are sent to the account holder and they usually shred them.  Our clients never know the account number, 3 digit code, expiration date, billing address, or the name of the account holder.  They simply benefit from having this information on their credit.  Very simple!
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: thailanddave on December 04, 2006, 09:46:40 pm
So let me get this straight. Your company puts me on other peoples credit cards so I can show a history. I never meet the people and I have never used the card, made a payment and can never use it but I show up as an authorized user.

You or your customers are not intending to defraud the credit bureau or the lenders who make credit decisions based on their reliance on the information. You and your company are just being good guys helping people out who don't or can't pay their bills and have gotten a bad credit rating. And you only charge $1000 for this?

Sorry I misunderstood. Im sure the credit bureaus and the lenders that pay them for accurate information would welcome a program like this. Everyone seems to win, except the pension fund that ends up with half million dollar bad loan in their member's retirement account portfolio. But 2 out of 3 is a winning percentage.

And I was so hoping that I could use the accounts I am an authorized user for. I'd pay a lot more than $1000 for that. Do you have a suggestion box?
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: wealthrx on December 04, 2006, 11:50:18 pm
The sad fact is that even W/O services like the credit line program that lenders are
so desperate to fund loans that 100% financing with a 580 fico score & 1 day out of bk
is possible!!

The credit line program does not guarantee that someone can qualify for a loan, any
underwriter (with 1/2 a brain) can see on the credit report that these accounts are listed
as Authorized User.

Isn't there a such thing as credit depth, collection/judgement payoffs? If a lender is Strictly
score driven, then they are leaving theselves vulnerable to loopholes in the credit system.
These programs are No Secret & lenders should do more due dilligence on the loans that
they fund if they have knowledge of these credit line services.

There are many other factors that determine whether or not someone gets approved for
financing. I have had clients w/ 750 scores (no authorized users) get denied for loans &
credit cards (lowes/menards) even with high fico score.

So the credit program in and of itself in not a real solution for most people, chances
are that they will have to and should clean-up other aspects of their credit profile in
conjunction with the program, if they decide to sign on.

I don't think that anyone here (maybe other than thaidave) truly believes that this service
will lead to a massive increase in the foreclosure market. And even if it does - that means more
business for the rest of us.

Sorry, but I can't complain about that...
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 05, 2006, 12:05:13 am
Well one thing is for sure, I get about 200 phone calls per day from loan officers who need this service.  So obviously it's working, and working well.  Some loan officers are even footing the bill for their clients and then putting it on the HUD1 statement at closing.  If that is not proof of confidence in this program then I don't know what is.  My clients are not complaining, the loan officers are not complaining..everyone seems to be satisfied.  The only people who complain or make negative comments are the people who truly just do not understand how this program works.  But that is okay because this is something that seems to good to be true.  I can accept that.  I just like when people ask questions and take the time to really listen to the answers.  I don't like when people try to mix in their own disbelief which completely is the opposite of the facts, and yet they choose to ignore it.  But I hope everyone who has read this learned something and walked away with a little more knowledge than before they got in on this convo.   Have a happy holiday everyone!
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: thailanddave on December 05, 2006, 11:16:44 pm
I am not saying this program will cause major foreclosures. I am saying it is fraudulent. Just because people buy it or pay for it for others to make a loan commission that may run several thousand dollars does not mean its legitimate.

Loan officers are paid to produce on a straight commission basis. There is more fraud now than ever as their commissions drop through a slowing market. 2 years ago everyone was trying to be a loan officer. My letter carrier for the post office even claimed she was a loan officer part time.

People have bad credit, usually for a reason. They don't pay their bills. Lenders look for people who do pay their bills to give loans to. If they don't pay their bills (as evidenced by their credit report) they don't want to lend them any money. Seems pretty simple to me.

Any program that puts info on their report in an attempt to specifically mislead someone, in this case the underwriter who is trying to make a decision for the lender, is committing fraud.

fraud is defined as:
*intentional deception resulting in injury to another person
*imposter: a person who makes deceitful pretenses
*something intended to deceive; deliberate trickery intended to gain an advantage

Just because people want it and are willing to pay for it does not change the situtation. Stikkee claims to get 200 calls per day. That's 25 calls per hour which tells me he works in a boiler room. Typical.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: wealthrx on December 06, 2006, 12:31:45 am
What kind of marketing are you doing to get those 200 calls?
(P.M:-X)
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: wealthrx on December 06, 2006, 01:09:39 am
I think that fraud is at an all time high in the mortgage business because lenders are
over saturating the market by making high risk subprime loans. Someone with a 580
fico, 3-$ 500.00 trade lines, and 1 day out of B.K. should not get a mortgage loan. Period...
Especially not at 100%.....But guess what, it happens everyday.  

What are the %'s of subprime loans vs. the %'s of A paper that go into foreclosure?
Lenders are taking alot more risk right now- more so than ever before - with crazy loan
products being issued in the subprime market. Higher risk =  Higher delinquencies..

Lenders know that less than 5% of their loans will go into foreclosure so they will more
than make up for their lossess with the 95% of people who Do pay on time each month.
They are borrowing money at the same rate, no matter what the risk level of the borrower
they lend to is.

What if a hotel runs at 95% occupancy each and every month would'nt that be considered
amazing accomplishment? What about landlords? 9.5 out of every 10 tenants that pay you
every month!! You can't lose.

I would think that someone who pays for this type of service will try much harder to keep their
scores at a high level by continuing to follow the blueprint that the new tradelines have put in
place for them. It shows that they have taken a proactive approach to maintaining a better
credit history then they ever have before.

Can anyone produce "real evidence" that these programs aren't legit??
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: Rich_in_CT on December 06, 2006, 11:18:47 am
Stikkee claims to get 200 calls per day. That's 25 calls per hour which tells me he works in a boiler room. Typical.
That's a call every 2.4 minutes, how can anything this intense be done in 2.4 minutes?  Something leads me to believe his figures are inflated.....
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: wealthrx on December 06, 2006, 12:12:19 pm
That's a call every 2.4 minutes, how can anything this intense be done in 2.4 minutes?  Something leads me to believe his figures are inflated.....

Maybe She meant that the company She works for gets 200 a day!!
Either way I want to know the marketing approach they use ;D ;D
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: Rich_in_CT on December 06, 2006, 12:14:09 pm
Maybe She meant that the company She works for gets 200 a day!!
Either way I want to know the marketing approach they use ;D ;D
They probably add a line to the bottom of porn and viagra spam.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: gwest101 on December 07, 2006, 02:10:46 pm
Stikke,
I noticed another poster mentioned something about the good credit score disappearing after a short period of time.  Is this correct?  How long can one expect to maintain the "bought" score?

Thanks
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: wealthrx on December 07, 2006, 09:10:29 pm
I should try that ;) (the marketing that is).
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 11, 2006, 09:53:28 am
GWEST...you can expect the seasoned tradelines to remain on your credit for about 6 months.  Sometimes longer depending on how quick the bureaus take to remove it.  But the average time is about 6 months.  After 6 months our account sellers take you off.  But sometimes it lingers!
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on December 11, 2006, 10:00:44 am
Yes..I myself get roughly an average of 200 calls per day.  I do not advertise.  Well...every now and then I throw and ad on craigslist..but that's it.  My business comes primarily from Loan officers who need to quickly boost a prospects score.  I get faxed credit reports all day long to review.  This program has spread through word of mouth.  The best people to advertise for me are the people who have had their scores increase.  They tell all their friends all their family and have the proof to show them.  Plus it does not hurt that I pay a $100 referral fee to anyone who referrs customers to me.  Some people are making $1000 a month extra just by sending people to ASR.  

Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: Rich_in_CT on December 11, 2006, 10:06:39 am
Yes..I myself get roughly an average of 200 calls per day.  I do not advertise.  Well...every now and then I throw and ad on craigslist..but that's it.  My business comes primarily from Loan officers who need to quickly boost a prospects score.  I get faxed credit reports all day long to review.  This program has spread through word of mouth.  The best people to advertise for me are the people who have had their scores increase.  They tell all their friends all their family and have the proof to show them.  Plus it does not hurt that I pay a $100 referral fee to anyone who referrs customers to me.  Some people are making $1000 a month extra just by sending people to ASR.  


Sounds like BS to me.  Even if you were working 10 hrs a day with no break you would need to take a call every 3 mins.  Sounds to me it would be hard to explain this program and sign someone up in just 3 mins of time.  And then when would you have time to respond to the mountain of faxes you cliam to get "all day long?"  Yeah, I'm throwing the yellow BS flag on this play.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: Maverick on January 06, 2007, 04:35:47 pm
Shouldn't take long to explain since people who are looking for it, already know what they're looking for.

I actually used ASR and no problems for me.

I lost my job in 2002 so some of my accounts I had to let get charged off. Took me all this time just to get back over 600 and be told over and over it's still not good enough.

Then when my score is good enough they say I have a chargeoff. Yet I was stupid enough to pay those. I should have disputed them over and over until they got sick of me. Because paying those LOWERED my score.

Now my score has gone up but I still have those marks. I'm working on those marks while having a higher score though. So I can do some things like put a roof over my family's heads now, when I couldn't before because the credit nazis Equifax, Experian and Transunion won't fix what they have on my reports.

A lot of the info is wrong and they removed some of my good accounts without me asking for them to be removed and they're not 7 years old either.

I won't deny the chargeoffs. I lost my job...I got harassed at my job, and I got fired. Guess they didn't believe men can get harassed and tormented too.

I'm getting crushed by a system that never says "Hey this guy got a bad break, let's give him a chance". Instead they want to crush me into submission.

Sorry but I believe there is a time and place for everything.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: markoarko on January 06, 2007, 05:17:19 pm
200 calls a day?

You get 200 calls PER day?

200 calls?  .... PER DAY?

REALLY!?
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on January 07, 2007, 02:07:31 am
Yes...that is the average # of phone calls.  People are finding that hard to believe but it is true.  There are millions of people out there who have had credit issues in the past.  Word of mouth is amazing and when you can truly provide a service for people, it gets out there.  You must remember..this is on a national scale.  200 calls is not alot when you are dealing with the entire nation.  Many of those calls are from skeptics and non-believers.  Most of them are referrals or people who visited the website.  I help loan officers, real estate agents, personal/car loan prospects and people who need a general boost for any reason.  You see...if a loan officer calls me and has 10 clients who need to raise their credit score, each of those people need to call and have their credit evaluated. We deal with hundreds of loan officers and realtors who have many many deals that had to be turned down due to credit.  Now...here comes ASR Solutions making those deals possible.  Trust me...200 calls is nothing compared to what the future holds!  The biggest topic today is CREDIT!
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: jimbojr on January 07, 2007, 01:35:00 pm
Build your own d... credit!

Just think if someone could package up CHARACTER and sell it to those who lacked it.

Neither they nor their buyers would posess it.

Jimbo

"Nothing earned = nothing gained"
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on January 07, 2007, 03:30:51 pm
That statement is void of any substance and definitely not a fair comparison.  Character and credit are 2 totally different things.  For one, character is a personality trait and credit maintenance is something that can be controlled if you understand it.  The problem is, most people do not understand how credit works.  If you give someone a credit card for $500, and they max it out with intentions to repay the $500 at the end of the month and they lose their job....then what?  If someone has a medical condition and no health insurance and the medical collection shows up on their credit report, it could drop their score dramatically.  Is that fair?  I do not like when people criticize this program for the wrong reasons.  Most people have good intentions and really want to do the right thing..or simply just need a little boost to accomplish something very important to them.
Remember, you can purchase a home with a 500 credit score.  But with a 600 credit score, you'll have to put less down and have a little better of an interest rate.  I am not changing the rules, just making it easier and more affordable for people.  Now what is wrong with that??
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: EpicDave on January 10, 2007, 09:56:28 pm
check this link from Inman
http://www.ewriting.pamil-visions.com/img/2006-03-10_-_Inman_-_Industry_watchdogs_warn_of_credit-booster_sites.pdf (http://www.ewriting.pamil-visions.com/img/2006-03-10_-_Inman_-_Industry_watchdogs_warn_of_credit-booster_sites.pdf)

Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on January 10, 2007, 10:26:15 pm
Yeah Yeah Yeah, I've read that article many times.....somebody is always going to have something to say.  Bottom line is..right now, right this moment the credit card companies allow authorized users to be added.  It's perfectly legal and that is the bottom line.  Nobody's fooling the creditors or lenders if they had a problem with authorized users they would change  their guidelines.  

Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: motomech10 on January 15, 2007, 08:49:21 am
The Inman report is dated 3/06. If it were determined to be fraud by the FBI or FTC, wouldn’t they have taken action by now?

I recall the days when a lender would actually pull your credit report and then base their decision on a multitude of factors and not just a number. These days FICO scores are relied on too heavily by lenders.  FICO has caused lenders to take the human element out of the equation. Was it intended to be used as the sole determining factor for credit worthiness? These days it is used by lenders as the first filter for deciding a persons loan qualifications.  Sometimes you must have a minimum number just to get an invitation from the lender to come in and sit down to discuss the loan further. Never mind that you might have additional information relevant to determining if the loan makes sense. Like when a consolidation loan could actually lower your debt and monthly payments. Instead of using the score as one of the many tools a lender has at their disposal, it is now used as THE deciding factor without further consideration. That practice impairs and harms otherwise worthy borrowers who but for some past incident beyond their control is now labeled high risk. An 800 score borrower is as susceptible to bad luck as a 600 score borrower.  FICO scores don’t reflect that, nor do lenders take it into consideration. Some would say luck should have nothing to do with it. I agree. But to be “FAIR” let’s remember luck works both ways.

My problem with the score is, it is only backward looking. Lenders consider your worthiness based on a “formula” which derives your score from information (or lack thereof), attained from previous lenders, without knowing the circumstances which created that information.  If the score is intended to represent ability to pay based on past performance, then why isn’t how they came to be also considered?  They are your numbers, you created them, you influence them. You change them with every financial situation you find yourself in. Including situations which may be no fault of your own. Also referred to as, that’s life.

How could trying to change your score be loan fraud? Is there a law requiring lenders to use FICO as part of their loan criteria?  I certainly never asked to be graded and scored for borrowing purposes. (or for insurance purposes) If lenders (and now insurance companies) choose to rely on FICO, they should do so at their own risk. No one is forcing them to do so that I am aware. As long as the borrower does not lie on the loan application, however the lender chooses to determine the borrowers qualification is up to them. Bottom line is it is their responsibility to do their due diligence.

I see it as leveling the playing field. Perhaps if a lender is aware that this is taking place,  they will do their due diligence and truly consider ALL the information a potential borrower brings to the table. And stop relying on some magical number produced from questionable information.

If the FBI and FTC want to investigate something, perhaps they should start with lenders who discriminate against people who they perceive to be high risk based solely on a number.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: thailanddave on January 15, 2007, 09:13:28 am
Lenders use the FICO scores to make the loan process more objective and less subjective. I've seen one underwriter turn down a file and another approve the very same file because they had been in the business longer and could read a file. If anything, lender standards are lower since they started placing more emphasis on FICO scores, not harder.

When loans are sold on the secondary market, the investor isn't going to look at each individual loan. They are buying a basket of loans that meet certain criteria. One of the criterias is the average FICO score.

when you borrow money, you agree to pay it back. You do not say, "I'll pay you back unless..." Would you loan money to someone who thinks they have a good reason not to pay you back?

If you have a low FICO score, its not because somebody is picking on you. Its because you haven't paid the lenders back as agreed. No ifs ands or buts. You are a bad credit risk because you haven't paid back your loans or credit cards. If you personally lent me $10,000 and I said, "Oh, I can't pay you back because..." how are you going to feel? how are you going to get your money back? Would you loan me money again? If someone came up to you and said "Thailanddave wants to borrow $10,000 from me, do you think I should lend it to him?" what would your advice be after I borrowed money from you and didn't pay you back. That's what a credit report is.

Oh, you lent out your credit card and somebody ran it up and its not your fault? Would you just leave $5000 laying around? If your credit card has a $5000 open limit, that's the same thing. If it was stolen, file a police report and you aren't responsible for the bill. If it wasn't stolen and someone ran it up on you, then you are responsible because you weren't responsible with your credit cards.

So you tell me, without FICO scores, how would an underwriter who has never met you decide if they should lend you $400,000? Maybe you have a good job and are a real nice guy, but if you don't pay your bills, nobody wants to lend you any more money you aren't likely to pay back. That's all an underwriter is trying to decide. Can you pay it back (your job), will you pay it back (your credit history) and do you have enough collateral (your house) that can be sold to get the money back if you don't pay voluntarily. Pretty simple stuff.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: motomech10 on January 15, 2007, 01:07:15 pm
“Lenders use the FICO scores to make the loan process more objective and less subjective.”

That would be great, if it were always true.  In the real world you must have a minimum score before even getting to discuss the loan. Today your just a number.  Many lenders  may as well hang a sign on the front door that reads: 620 and below need not bother apply.

“If anything, lender standards are lower since they started placing more emphasis on FICO scores, not harder.”

Correct. They place too much emphasis on FICO scores and stopped looking at the borrower and their credit history. A lender can base a loan on anything they like. And to often judge on numbers which don’t reflect a borrowers true worthiness.  This leaves  many good borrowers who otherwise might be a good risk, out.

“When loans are sold on the secondary market, the investor isn't going to look at each individual loan. They are buying a basket of loans that meet certain criteria. One of the criterias is the average FICO score.”

Thanks for making my point. That we’re just a number.

”when you borrow money, you agree to pay it back.”

When you loan money, you accept risk.  No one is forcing you to make a loan.  But if you decide to, it’s under your terms to which borrowers must agree. Not the other way around.  

 “You do not say, "I'll pay you back unless..."

You do not loan based on a best case scenario. You loan on a worst case scenario and are well compensated for your exposure. Things happen beyond the control of the borrower and the best you can do is hope nothing goes wrong. If that were not the case you would never make a loan.

“If  you have a low FICO score, its not because somebody is picking on you. Its because you haven't paid the lenders back as agreed. No ifs ands or buts. You are a bad credit risk because you haven't paid back your loans or credit cards.”

A low FICO score could mean many things. One of which might be because you didn’t pay back “as agreed”.  That could mean late or not at all.  In the case where someone may have been late on a some payments but did ultimately pay everything in full, has little or no debt and still can’t get a loan despite good income, assets and equity, a low FICO score doesn’t truly represent their worthiness.

"So you tell me, without FICO scores, how would an underwriter who has never met you decide if they should lend you $400,000? "

Look at my credit history, look at my current situation, ask me about late payments in my report, and determine if I am a good risk based on current relevant information instead of a backward looking number which tells you nothing about whether I am a good risk today. Again, FICO has taken the human element out of the equation. “Pretty simple stuff.”

“If someone came up to you and said "Thailanddave wants to borrow $10,000 from me, do you think I should lend it to him?" what would your advice be after I borrowed money from you and didn't pay you back. That's what a credit report is.”

I don’t have an issue with credit report history. In fact I wish lenders would use it more and FICO less. My issue is that lenders won’t even take time to look at your CR because they have already looked at your mid score and determined you are just to high a risk.

"Maybe you have a good job and are a real nice guy, but if you don't pay your bills, nobody wants to lend you any more money you aren't likely to pay back. That's all an underwriter is trying to decide. Can you pay it back (your job), will you pay it back (your credit history) and do you have enough collateral (your house) that can be sold to get the money back if you don't pay voluntarily. Pretty simple stuff."

Let me give you a real life scenario of how someone can fall through the cracks thanks to FICO.

Middle score of around 600. Good income. Nice guy. Had some late payments in the past, but paid everything in full. Never went bankrupt. Currently owe less then 45k in total debt. Own my house (recent professional appraisal 65k) with no liens. All I am seeking is a loan so that I can consolidate my existing 45k debt (950  monthly) to one lower monthly payment (750+- monthly)with better rates and the benefit of being able to have the interest to write off.  Makes sense right?
The first thing I am told is without at least a 620 score they can’t help me.  No pulling credit reports. No need to, I told them my mid score. So I go to the “subprime” lender market.  They are happy to take a look. But it will cost you dearly. Higher rates, higher closing costs and more restrictions. All as a result of what? A number. A number which doesn’t tell the lender anything about me the borrower except that I may be considered high risk. When in fact I could be less risk then someone with a 700 score who has been able to borrow much more then they could manage all thanks to having a “good” score. God forbid they have some major life altering situation which leaves them with reduced income for a short period. As a result they fall behind on some payments.  Not that they don’t want to make this months payment to you. But they just can’t at this time. As a result their score drops. Eventually they get back on their feet and in no time are all caught up again. Problem now is those late payments dropped their score. As  result they’re interest rates go up. Their monthly payments go up. Now they are having a hard time making the minimums. They sure looked good on paper when you loaned them the money. Nothing indicated they might fall behind. Not even their great score!

It’s not the FICO score that’s the problem, it’s the lender who puts to much dependence into it and nothing else.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on January 17, 2007, 10:08:38 pm
The credit bureaus scoring methods are a joke!  I have seen people with almost identical credit reports have 2 totally different credit scores.  I have had clients send me their credit reports that they pulled from MYFICO.com or one of those companies, and when I pull their credit report the next day or even the same day, the scores are all together different.  As said above by "motomech" lenders decided to take credit scores as their main determining factor for lending.  Nobody is forcing them to do that, they use the lazy way out rather than pulling apart the credit report and checking the true credit worthiness of a borrower.  Almost all loans are qualified through DU (Desktop Underwriting) A computer is left to decide the fate of your American dream.  

For example, if a first time homebuyer has 10 tradelines on their credit report and 7 out of the 10 have either had a late payment or missed payment, their credit scores are going to be very very low.  However, with further investigation, you find that this potential homebuyer rented for 10 years and was never late on their rent, not even an hour late.  If this person wants to boost their scores to qualify for a home loan, there is nothing wrong with that.  People bust their butts to pay rent and it is never reported to the credit bureaus...shouldn't on time rent payments be one of the strong determining factors in qualifying a person for a mortgage?  I would think the answer would be yes, but rental history is completely null and void if the credit scores are too low.  These are the type of situations that make seasoned tradelines seem all the better!  They make life hard enough, and this one way to ease some of the pain that people experience on a daily basis!

 :D
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: boostscores.com on January 24, 2007, 03:31:05 pm
Everyone just leave him alone. No one has offered proof that it is illegal or a scam. Just your opinions. Which aint worth jack compared to the facts. And the fact is yes it is legal. here is my proof supporting this. 1. Straight from the Credit Burreaus mouth. 2. Straight from the Federal Trade Commission. Links to the resources are below after the quote from the FTC

"Account "Users"
If you open an individual account, you may authorize another person to use it. If you name your spouse as the authorized user, a creditor who reports the credit history to a credit bureau must report it in your spouse's name as well as in your's (if the account was opened after June 1, 1977). A creditor also may report the credit history in the name of any other authorized user.

Advantages/Disadvantages: User accounts often are opened for convenience. They benefit people who might not qualify for credit on their own, such as students or homemakers. While these people may use the account, you - not they - are contractually liable for paying the debt.

"


1.http://www.experian.com/ask_max/max060105b.html (http://www.experian.com/ask_max/max060105b.html)
2.http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/credit/divorce.htm (http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/credit/divorce.htm)
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: motomech10 on January 24, 2007, 03:47:55 pm
Thank you for those links.  This will help me convince people that it is a perfectly legal. This not only proves it, it is a legitimate method for helping those who could benefit from it. THANKS!!
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: boostscores.com on January 24, 2007, 06:36:21 pm
No problem. I have a ton of articles supporting the FACTS. While some people may think its unethical or immoral the fact remains that it is 100% legal and the FTC and the Credit Bureas recognize it.

Wanna see a quote from the Fair Isaaic, the creator of the FICO Score? And how he recognizes authorized user accounts and the benefits and how it affects the fico score. Can't get no more proof than that. Let me know and i'll post the links
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: motomech10 on January 24, 2007, 07:46:19 pm
Please do.  Knowledge is power.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: stikkee on January 26, 2007, 12:31:40 am
Thank you boostscores for that priceless information.  I'm so glad that people can actually go read information about this at a government site.  This should shut down the skeptics and non-believers.  The problem when it comes to the topic of credit is "lack of knowledge!"  Your right motomech
Posted by: motomech10     Posted on: Wed. Jan 24, 2007, 07:01 PM
Please do.  Knowledge is power

Knowledge is definitely power when it comes to this subject.  People immediately have something negative to say before they understand how it works and what the purpose of seasoned tradelines truly is.  Trust me...if the government didn't like it, they would not allow it and would shut anyone who sells seasoned tradelines down and/or slap them with fines.  This is a great program for people who want to be proactive in their financial future.   ;)
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: Rich_in_CT on January 26, 2007, 06:16:52 am
I have an excellent credit score obtained by paying my bills on time......maybe everyone should try that? If you can't pay your credit card or personal mortgage on time what makes you think you can own and manage peices of real estate? ???  
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: motomech10 on January 26, 2007, 07:43:01 am
I have an excellent credit score obtained by paying my bills on time......maybe everyone should try that?

God forbid some tragic incident should happen to you or a family member causing you to fall behind.

Everyone is only 1 heartbeat and breath away from not being able to pay their bills on time. Could be a car accident on your way home tonight. Cancer, heart attack, stroke, your house burns down, you lose your job, hurricane, tornado or some other natural disaster.  The point is just because bad things happen to people should not automatically mean they are a bad risk. Does the system take into account how hard people work to recover from such incidents? They get caught up on their obligations and are ready to resume where they left off, only to find out they can’t get a loan, or get charged higher rates, because they were late on a few payments.

If you can't pay your credit card or personal mortgage on time what makes you think you can own and manage peices of real estate? ???  

You gotta love people who are holier than tho’ and are so quick to pass judgment on others without knowing a thing about them. Such is the case when lenders only look at a number to determine worthiness.

It’s well known that lenders use predatory lending practices and take advantage of people who have fallen on tough times. Hopefully congress will do more to level the playing field.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=2822510

In the mean time it’s nice to know there are legal and legitimate tools at my disposal which can help me get back to where I deserve to be.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: Rich_in_CT on January 26, 2007, 07:46:29 am
And many people that have lousy credit have lousy credit because they can't manage their finances, in many cases its not related to bad luck, disease or tradgedy.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: motomech10 on January 26, 2007, 07:49:19 am
Yes, I accept that. Which proves my point, the system is not fair. Why should everyone else be lumped in with them? Is that truely fair? Is that what you would want after paying all your debts on time?
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: Rich_in_CT on January 26, 2007, 09:19:23 am
Any people wonder why I will NEVER use a property management company.....
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: 71tr on January 26, 2007, 12:06:45 pm
No problem. I have a ton of articles supporting the FACTS. While some people may think its unethical or immoral the fact remains that it is 100% legal and the FTC and the Credit Bureas recognize it.

The fact that the FTC and the Credit Bureaus recognize that our spouses or children might be designated as authorized users to our credit accounts can hardly be construed as an approval of the seasoned credit line concept.  The business model sells good credit history to unrelated parties with poor credit history in an attempt to mislead future credit grantors.  That hardly meets the definition of ethical.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: motomech10 on January 26, 2007, 12:32:53 pm
But isn’t it a fact that anyone has the legal right to add anyone they like as AU to their account? If so, then lenders know this. If they don’t, they should. If they do know, then they are not being mislead.

Again, we didn’t invent this system, it has been imposed on us. If lenders choose of their own free will to look only at numbers, then they are the ones not doing their due diligence.
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: boostscores.com on January 26, 2007, 12:45:27 pm
Here we go again. This is not a topic about ethics. It's about the law and the law says it is legal.
If it was about ethics than don't you think that should be up to the purchaser of the tradelines. Who cares what anybody else thinks. Ethical huh... what about the credit bureas selling your information to anyone who wants it. Who told them they could add me to their database anyway?  Just a few thoughts of what some people might be thinking.

"Are you going to pay my bills" "
"Are you going to help me with seed money for a new business"
Title: Re:Seasoned Credit Lines!
Post by: Rich_in_CT on January 26, 2007, 01:23:42 pm
I think everyone has made their points, no need to drag this out further.

/lock